Explore the G blues scale with acclaimed mandolinist Andrew Hendryx. Originally appeared on a Facebook Live Lesson on Sunday, April 5th, 2020. Keep up with Andrew HERE!
Tag: features
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Trainwreck Express “Nancy”
Preamp tubes: one ECC83, one 7025, one 12AX7 (all NOS 12AX7 types). Output tubes: two Mullard EL34, fixed-bias. Rectifier: solidstate Controls: Volume, Treble, Middle, Bass, Presence, Bright switch. Output: approximately 40 watts RMS. World’s most desirable amplifier? Aside from any “standard” vintage amps that have been elevated through their associations with major artists, the few original-design, made-by-hand amps out there that wear the Dumble and Trainwreck brands have long been the two most desirable lines on the planet.
Given that tone guru Ken Fischer is no longer with us, Trainwrecks are arguably fixed to an even higher standard by the laws of supply and demand. Please welcome, then, this rare appearance of “Nancy,” an early Trainwreck Express model built by Fischer in 1986 in his New Jersey shop. One of what is believed by its maker’s own estimation to be “probably 100 Trainwrecks in the world,” Nancy (Fischer used feminine names on his amps rather than serial numbers) is nevertheless no under-glass collector’s piece, but a living, (fire) breathing tone machine that has continued to pay her way in the hands of hard-working musicians since rolling out of the shop 23 years ago, and that’s more than you can say for a lot of $35,000 vintage gear out there today.
Owned for the past five years by guitarist and producer Matte Henderson, who has worked with everyone from Henry Kaiser and Robert Fripp to Jewel and Natalie Merchant, Nancy was previously played for many years by a hard-gigging guitarist from Texas, whose taped-on notes “5” and “6” still adorn the input and speaker outs, reminders of which cable goes where.
Although Fischer maintained two relatively steady models in the Liverpool and the Express, and added the Rocket to the lineup a few years later, each amp really was an individual creation, and no two were ever exactly alike. Each was tweaked to suit his evolving notions of perfect tone, and to meet the desires of the player for whom he was building it, and components also varied throughout the decade and a half that he was manufacturing amps. Recalling his first encounter with Trainwreck, Henderson tells us, “Henry Kaiser invited me to California to record with him in 1990, and he had eight Dumbles at the time, so I was really looking forward to trying those. When I got there, he said, ‘I just got this amp here…’ and plugged me into a Trainwreck Liverpool. I just went, ‘Oh my God, I’ve got to get one of these!’ So I bought a Liverpool from Kenny, and an Express after that.” In addition to becoming a customer, Henderson also acted as a handy phone demo guy for Fischer: potential customers would discuss the amps with the maker, then call Henderson for a quick over-the-phone playing demonstration to hear what they sounded like.
The Liverpool and Express are differentiated, most obviously, by their use of four EL84s and two EL34s, respectively. As a result, the former is usually referred to as being “Voxy” to the latter’s “Marshally,” though every one of each model is also quite different from either of those vintage British brands. Nancy further differentiates itself from later Expresses by being one of the earlier versions made with the Stancor transformers from the Chicago Standard Transformer Company, which Fischer used from 1985 to ’89. As Fischer himself related, “In 1989… Stancor stopped making those transformers, so I bought up all they had left of those to get me through the year with a few spares.” Post-1990, he used “…about 12 different transformer companies.”
Aside from merely being historically interesting, the use of Stancors in the earlier Expresses such as this one also signaled a different sonic signature. Where later “black tranny” Expresses leaned more heavily toward high-gain tones, the Stancor Trainwrecks, though still plenty gainy when you want them to be, had a slightly browner, more vintagey blues-rock vibe. “It’s more of a small-box ’68 Marshall,” Henderson confirms. “Tube tuning is what these amps are all about; they run fairly low plate voltages (around 380 volts DC on the EL34s).” What really makes Trainwrecks tick, of course, is the circuit going on underneath the hood, and more than that, the way Fischer laid out the components, connected the wires, and selected individual resistor and capacitor types and values by hand to fine-tune the overall tone and feel of the amplifiers. The intense skill that the man applied to his craft is further attested to by the fact that, while other makers have lifted the lids on existing Trainwrecks and copied their circuits, any experienced Tranwreck player will tell you that none of these so-called “clones” ever quite attains the sensitivity and complexity of Fischer’s own creations.
In addition to – arguably in contrast to – their unparalleled electrical workings, Trainwrecks sported decidedly DIY-looking cabinets and cosmetics. As a case in point, check out Nancy’s polished hardwood shell and front panels, the wood-burner etched control legends and starburst motif, and the stick-on Dymo labels that tell you what’s what ’round the rear. Guitarists who were not in the know years back could be forgiven for passing one of these over as some tubehead’s basement Marshall-like project, but any player who had a shot at one for reasonable money in the late ’80s or early ’90s and didn’t bite is certainly kicking themselves now.
The first Trainwreck Liverpool rolled out the door in 1983 at a price of $650. A year later that was raised to $1,000 for either model, then through the course of the ’90s inflation took it to $1,200, then $1,600, then finally $1,800 as the cost of parts increased. Long unable to build any new amps due to a raft of illnesses, Fischer saw the price of used Trainwrecks rise to $22,000 or more during his lifetime, and in the three years since his death on December 23, 2006, good Trainwrecks have pushed past the $30,000 mark. While he was still making amps, he not only offered customers a two-week trial with a full money-back guarantee, but declared he would refund the cost of shipping both ways if a buyer wanted to return his amp. None ever did.
Shortly before his death, Fischer revised the offer. “Several years back I instituted a policy; any Trainwreck amp out there has a ‘triple-your-money-back’ original-purchase-price guarantee. So if you’ve got a Trainwreck and you don’t want it any more, send it back to me and I’ll look up the original purchase price and refund it triple.” As it happens, the “new policy” had no takers either.
Dave Hunter is an American musician and journalist who has worked in both Britain and the U.S. He’s a former editor of The Guitar Magazine (UK).
This article originally appeared in VG May 2010 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.
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The House of Stathopoulo Harp Guitar
The circa 1920 House of Stathopoulo harp guitar. Harp guitar photo courtesy of Epiphone. One of the rarest Epiphone instruments in the world, the House of Stathopoulo harp guitar lends a glimpse into a transitional era prior to the formation of what would become one of the most recognizable names in guitar history. A definitive link that establishes the real origins of another legendary one-of-a-kind instrument – the Roy Smeck Octochorda – in 2007, the House of Stathopoulo harp guitar was acquired by Dave Berryman, President of Gibson, from a collection owned by the late Jim Fisch, co-author of the book, Epiphone: The House of Stathopoulo.
The Stathopoulo family legacy starts in 1903, when 40-year-old Greek immigrant and luthier Anastasios Stathopoulo came to New York. He established himself as a maker and importer of instruments, including Greek bouzoukis, mandolins, and even violins and cellos. A fine example of his early work is the 1907 mandolin (shown here) that was sitting on a shelf in Epiphone’s Nashville headquarters. The basic design is similar to other bowl-back mandolins of that period, but also shows off the skills of a very experienced luthier, with beautifully intricate inlay and purflings made of mother-of-pearl, abalone, and ebony, with a solid tortoiseshell bridge and inlaid pickguard.
In 1909, Anastasios (not yet a U.S. citizen) patented a “new, original and ornamental design for the Mandolin” (Pat. 40,010). Its most striking feature was the cello-style scrolled headstock with a carved animal’s head that appeared on several of his instruments. Tragically, this era ended abruptly in 1915, when Anastasios, a 52-year-old husband and father of six, died from “a long illness.”
(LEFT TO RIGHT) The sextachorda sound hole shows six strings and a faint outline of its label. The 1910 A. Stathopoulo bouzouki label. The harp-guitar label. By 1917, the newly christened “House of Stathopoulo” ushered in the second era in the history of the family’s growing musical instrument business, including the first of three banjo designs by Epi Stathopoulo, Anastasios’ eldest son and general manager. Unfortunately, little is known about this period following Anastasios’ death by way of advertising or company catalogs. A 1920 trade magazine, The Violinist, barely mentions the Stathopoulo shop on West 39th Street, despite its self-proclaimed 40 years of experience as a dealer and importer of violins. It would take several years before the Epiphone name became synomous with high-quality instruments like the Recording banjos of the 1920s and the Masterbilt archtop guitars of the ’30s.
There are no company catalogs or price lists with harp guitars, and strangely, no mention of a harp guitar in the Epiphone book. The label inside the body identifies “House of Stathopoulo, New York” as its maker, yet the harp guitar seems to lack the “quality workmanship, strength, and durability” stated on it. The missing corner of the label may have had a date, and the hand-written “No. 781” doesn’t narrow it down, since there are no serial number records prior to 1935. Although previously dated as circa 1910, it’s far more likely the harp guitar was built between 1920 and ’22, and clearly is not the work of a master craftsman like Anastasios Stathopoulo, which would have dated it to pre-1915.
The Roy Smeck Octachorda. Photo by Peter Maloy/VG Archive. The enormous two-piece rosewood back still has visible kerf marks from a lack of adequate planing and scraping. All six linear feet of the higher-grade rosewood rims are nicely formed, but not quite a match to the back. The shape of the mirrored pegheads may have inspired another Greek-American luthier, one Clarence Leonidas “Leo” Fender, but are a bit crude with more visible saw marks, indicative of a novice builder. They join each of the two necks with loose V joints that split and cracked under the strain of the strings. Scott Harrison, head of Epiphone’s R&D department, can point to several poorly repaired cracks, sloppy refinishing, and patches, extra bracing, and enough excess glue inside the body for three harp guitars. The massive rosewood bridge anchors the six strings and six sub-bass strings, but three extra holes in the peghead seems to indicate it once had a total of 15 strings. The bare spot on the top was probably the pickguard’s location, but no evidence of what type, or if it was original or added later. However, there are several design features that are distinctly Epiphone, including the mother-of-pearl fingerboard inlays of varying shapes and sizes, and the seven-piece laminated neck construction.
The heart-shaped sound hole, off-center bridge, and asymmetrical 20″ lower bout help it stand as a one-of-a-kind creation and provide a glimpse into a transitional period prior to the formation of the Epiphone Banjo Corporation. It also speaks volumes about how the Stathopoulo brothers struggled to establish an identity building new, original designs.
This harp guitar provides a link between The House of Stathopoulo and the Roy Smeck Octochorda, another unusual eight-string Hawaiian guitar that until recently had never been associated with Epiphone. Stories floating around about the origins of the octochorda credit Sam Moore, a vaudeville-era novelty instrumentalist, as being its inventor. Well, Moore may have been the first performer to use an octochorda, but a 1922 article stated it was invented by Harry Skinner of Chicago, who worked in Lyon & Healy’s violin department. Skinner also co-authored Moore’s first hit, “Laughing Rag,” with Moore on octochorda. A 1924 photo showed the vaudeville team of Moore and Freed as “…enthusiastic users of Lyon & Healy Instruments” with Moore playing their Bell Guitar.
A minstrel group with two Gibson harp guitars, mandolin, and the House of Stathopoulo sextachorda, second from left. Photo courtesy of Ben Elder. Sometime in 1923, another talented multi-instrumentalist, Roy Smeck, met Moore while on the Orpheum and Keith vaudeville circuit, and according to Vincent Cortese, author of Roy Smeck: The Wizard of the Strings in His Life and Times, Smeck said, “Sam Moore invented the octachorda tuning” (open E7) and “[Smeck] was the only other one to play the octachorda in vaudeville.” Smeck also stated that his octochorda was one of only two made, but “[Sam’s] was a regular guitar, without the heart-shaped sound hole.” A music-trade editorial from June, 1924, supports Smeck’s claim and specifically mentions the octachorda as “the only one in its existence.” The logical conclusion is Harry Skinner’s invention was probably an eight-string version of the Lyon & Healy Bell Guitar, not an earlier version of Smeck’s octochorda. Several other accounts credit the Harmony Company with building the octochorda, and Smeck himself is mainly responsible for this story. “Roy told me Harmony built the octochorda,” said Cortese. But after seeing pictures of the House of Stathopoulo harp guitar, commented, “Now you got me scratching my head… everything happened for Roy after the Vitaphone film,” including his association with Harmony.
Vinny was, of course referring to Roy’s overnight rise to stardom after appearing in Warner Brother’s 1926 Vitaphone short film, His Pastimes. Roy was signed for $350 by Harry Warner, one of the four original Warner Brothers, to appear in what became Smeck’s chance of a lifetime. On August 6, 1926, more than a year before Warner Brothers released the first feature length-talking picture, The Jazz Singer, highbrow New Yorkers paid a whopping $10 to see the feature film Don Juan, starring John Barrymore. The prelude included a series of short talkies by renowned artists of the day like operatic singers Anna Case and Giovanni Martinelli, Ephrim Zimbalist, Sr., and the newly discovered “Wizard of the Strings,” Roy Smeck. As New Times reviewer Mordant Hall wrote the next day, “The seductive twanging of a guitar manipulated by Roy Smeck captured the audience. Every note appeared to come straight from the instrument and one almost forgot that the Vitaphone was responsible for the realistic effect.” In fact, this was no mere guitar, but the then-unknown octochorda.
1907 Anastasios Stathopoulo mandolin. Photo courtesy of Epiphone. In 1927, the President of Harmony, Jay Krauss, approached Roy with an endorsement deal to take advantage of the incredible success of the Vitaphone film and introduced the Vita-Uke, followed by several other designs including the six-string Vita-Guitar. Some of these “novelty” instruments had sound holes shaped like trained seals, and others had airplane-shaped “aero-bridges,” meant to capitalize on the celebrity of Charles Lindbergh. It certainly paid off, as a reported 500,000 units were sold in the first three years. The wizard had his octochorda long before Harmony came knocking. Further proof is an editorial from 1924 announcing that Smeck was signed by Paul Specht’s Alamac Orchestra for “orchestral and solo recording work” using seven instruments, including the octochorda. This was after the tour with Olga Myra and the Southland Entertainers, when Roy first met Sam Moore
Unfortunately, the octochorda disappeared circa 1930. One account says it was stolen from Smeck’s hotel room, but another explanation is his brief marriage and ensuing divorce from Olga Myra, a contortionist/dancer/violinist, who “…left me with $7 and a ukulele.”
The octochorda doesn’t appear on any Smeck recordings after 1928, and apparently vanished from the face of the earth. That is until one fateful day in 1994, when uke collector Randy Klimpert visited an antique shop and noticed a strange instrument, tagged “Circa 1890 Handcrafted: Possibly Spanish.” The shop owner offered a creative tale of his own, telling Klimpert it was “…made by slaves for their master during the Civil War.” Without knowing what it was, Klimpert bought it and after a bit of research realized it was in fact, the Roy Smeck Octochorda. In a cruel twist of fate, it happened just months after Smeck died at age 94.
Nobody knows how the octochorda wound up in an antique shop, and there are few clues regarding its life after Smeck. One exception is its appearance in the 1973 book The Steel String Guitar, by Donald Brosnac, in which it appears with the caption, “Harmony Octochorda 1929 – Photographed at the Harmony Guitar Co.” and sporting a giant carved-eagle bridge that was not on Smeck’s ’20s version. At some point, Harmony could have added the bridge and claimed the instrument as their own design, but the 1929 dating is clearly not accurate.
A circa 1924 Roy Smeck with the Stathopoulo Octochorda with the Alamac Orchestra and Paul Specht standing with violin. Photo courtesy of Jim Garber. As it turns out, the harp guitar and octochorda were not the only two examples of these unique designs. A photo belonging to renowned harp guitarist Gregg Miner shows a similar instrument with six strings – a “sextachorda” with mother-of-pearl and abalone inlay and purfling around the body and sound hole. Though its peghead is obscured in the photo, there is a faint outline of a standard six-string slot-head configuration, and it is shown being played like a conventional six-string, not lap-style.
So, the harp guitar, Roy Smeck’s octochorda, and the sextachorda share many traits. Were they designed and built by Epi Stathopoulo himself? Perhaps, as all three share the downward-slanting cutaway that would reappear on Epiphone’s Recording Guitars of the late 1920s/early ’30s. In a sense, the octochorda’s cello-style scroll-top peghead is a fitting tribute to Anastasios Stathopoulo’s 1909 mandolin design, and brings our story full circle to when a Greek immigrant wanted to make instruments that would stand out.
Copyright 2009 Paul M. Fox.
This article originally appeared in VG May 2010 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.
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Lynyrd Skynyrd
Gary Rossington with his signature Gibson SG. Photo by Rick Gould. Gary Rossington leads the charge against the challenge that has always come with being a member of Lynyrd Skynyrd.
The band and its musical patriarch have defined resilience in their march forward, keeping the music fresh and vibrant with longtime friends/co-guitarists Rickey Medlocke and Hughie Thomasson, regular album releases, and diligent touring.
And the fates have given Rossington no breaks. In early 2003 he underwent triple-bypass heart surgery. But the guitarist, far from being the type to complain, was soon back at it, recording and prepping a world tour.
We recently caught up with Rossington, Medlocke, and Thomasson as they set out on the road to support their latest offering, Viscious Cycle, and soak up some of the rewards that come with being veterans – like having Gibson/Epiphone issue no fewer than three guitars in their honor!
Photo by Michael Wilson Gary Rossington
Vintage Guitar: What inspired you to become a musician, and how did the guitar become your main instrument?
Gary Rossington: It was actually Elvis, way back when. I used to take a broom and play it in front of a mirror, like him on guitar.
Then, when the Beatles, Stones, and all of the British groups came out, that’s what got me going. I was 13 or 14 when the Beatles came out and Allen, Ronnie, and me saw those guys [and] thought they were so cool. We wanted to be like them, and I wanted to play guitar! I thought guitar was the neatest thing. We taught ourselves and went for it.What was your first guitar?
I still got it, believe it or not – an early-’60s Silvertone from Sears I bought with money from doing a paper route. They had an acoustic for eight bucks. Then they had this electric with a case and a speaker in it. I got that one and I still own it – and it still works.What’s the story about how you got your 1959 Les Paul?
The first time we were ever in Nashville, playing a club called the Briar Patch, a girl said she had a Gibson Les Paul in her closet. That’s all she knew.
So we went to her house and it was a nice Les Paul. It was in great shape, but you could see it hadn’t been picked up for a long time. They didn’t know what they had and they wanted to sell it for $1,000. So I went back with $1,000 and they said, “No.” Somebody told them it was worth $2,000 to $3,000. I told them not to sell it.
A few weekends went by and we were playing that club again, so I went over and got it.Why did you name it after your mother, Bernice?
My father died when I was 10, so my mother raised me. She helped us get the band going, and helped me buy guitars. I had a paper route, but she put money in even though we didn’t have much. I just loved her a lot and missed her a lot when I was on the road, so I called it Bernice.When did Gibson approach you about the Rossington signature Les Paul and SG guitars?
A year or so ago, a guy from Gibson called and asked if he could copy mine to do a signature model. I thought it was the neatest thing since sliced bread, because I love Gibson guitars. I’ve always played Les Pauls, and bought a lot of them. But they wanted to do this in honor of me, and it is such an honor!
They had Bernice for about a week. They drew it out and re-created the scars, nicks, and scratches, then put the same pickups, knobs, electronics, and hardware on it. It looks just like my original. They did the same with the ’61 SG I played “Freebird” on.
I’ve had a few other guitars throughout the years, but I’ve still got both originals. I use one [of the signature models] onstage now because I don’t want to take the originals out. I’ve used both for “Freebird” and one of the signature Les Pauls for the whole set. It’s real nice. It sounds great and stays in tune. I love it!What gauge of strings do you typically use?
I use .010, .013, .017, .026, .036, .046 Dean Markleys. They’re great.What amps are you using live and in the studio?
In the studio, I’ve always used the same Peavey Mace. It’s 25 or 30 years old. I put new tubes in it every year, as well as new wires and fuses when it needs it. It sounds really good.
We got a deal with Peavey long ago; Hartley Peavey gave us a couple of amps, and we been using ’em ever since. I think they sound great.
We used to use Marshalls, and Rickey still uses Marshalls. We also used Line 6 Amp Farm [software] in the studio, which sound like just about any kind of amp.Talk about Vicious Cycle. What was the inspiration for the material?
I’m proud of that album because we worked so hard on it. We put our hearts and souls into it to show people that [although] there are new faces, we’re the same band and the same spirit. We had to prove we’re more than just an old band playing old songs. We got a couple new writers, and some of the songs were taken from real stories. We tried to write about things that are going on today, and about the way we felt.
We try to keep our style and sound – be the real deal, and not use a bunch of effects, so we can play ’em live!
Everything we write or put on a record, we want to be able to play live, if people like it. So we did all that on this record.
I believe this year we had something to prove, what with the new faces in the band. There was a lot of talk about why we were still going on. When you’re involved with something like this, it’s bigger than all of us. People want to hear the old songs and the new. We’re gonna play a bunch of ’em this summer along with the old, and it’s going to be fun. When we play the old songs, I feel Ronnie, Allen, Steve, and Leon – all of them – onstage with us. It’s spiritual.
Gary Rossington with his Les Paul Standard, onstage with Skynyrd in the 1970s. Photo by Rick Gould. What inspires your songwriting?
I think it comes through you. Any guitar player can come up with a few riffs. [Once I come up with a riff], I add to it and Rickey, Hughie, and Johnny will expand on my idea. With lyrics, once we get an idea, we sit around and throw lyrics back and forth.
Most of the songs are true stories. “Hell Or Heaven” is about people I see every day; they’re in hell because of their life, what they got themselves into, or the way they think about everything. But they can make heaven on Earth if they just appreciate the good things in life.
“Lucky Man” is about why we all feel so lucky. We’ve been through a lot of tragedy and a lot of hard times. But you know it’s just life. And if you look at some places around the world, you think about how bad those people have it… they don’t even have food or water. It makes you think about how lucky you are.
We’ve had a lot of bad luck and bad accidents, but we’re so lucky to be able to be playing music and to be in America. We have fans come every night, and families who love us. What more do you need? We’re lucky to be able to play music and do something we love. Skynyrd lives on. The name, the music, and all the guys.
As long as we can play the music they helped create, they’re still alive and people will remember them. It’s a big thing and I feel lucky to be a part of it.“Red, White and Blue” has been embraced as a patriotic anthem. How did that song come about?
That was written by Johnny, Donnie [Van Zandt], and the Warren brothers [Brett and Brad]. The first time I heard it, I loved it. I hate to say it, but it’s totally us. You know, our hair is turning white and we’ve always been red-blooded Americans, and rednecks.
It’s such a pretty song and such a great song to play. I always use a Gibson Les Paul or a Gibson SG. But on that song, I used Rickey’s Stratocaster because it just happened to be plugged in. It’s the only song I think I’ve ever played on a Strat.Is that you playing the bird call at the end?
Yeah, at the very end, that’s me. I did that with a slide. I did it for “Freebird,” too. I turn the slide upside down and sort of hit the string with the side of the bottle and it just makes it sing.What kind of slide do you use?
I use a Coricidan bottle I got from Duane Allman. He was one of my big inspirations. I just love him and I got to meet him and know him.
I always use glass because it has the best sound, more sustain, and it gets that true “scratchy” sound. I’ve got about a hundred of them.What tuning did you use on the new record?
We play in standard tuning and Rickey uses dropped-D tuning. But on “Dead Man Walkin’,” we all tuned to open G. We wrote it on an old Dobro blues guitar, and that’s Rickey playing it.With three guitar players in the band, how do you construct parts?
We think about it, and play off of each other. Once you’ve got one part, you don’t want somebody doing what you’re doing, so you’ve got to write a counterpart. We’ve been playing together so long that we know each other and what we’re going to do.
I’ll play my part then show it to Rickey or vice versa. Then he’ll come up with a counterpart to it that’s a little different. On “Lucky Man” there was enough rhythm going, so I just played slide. Same with “Red, White and Blue.”
You have to listen and write your own part. Then somebody else writes their part to you. In days before, I’ve written or thought of parts to go with my part. I’d show Allen or Ed King or one of those guys, but usually they all do it themselves. That’s why it’s a band.
When you get a band together instead of just studio cats or certain people, if you write a part or a song and then you go and present it to the band, everybody puts their parts to it. It just grows and grows. Sometimes it becomes a great song.You must be really proud to be celebrating the 30th anniversary of the band.
Yes, I’m very proud of being a part of Skynyrd, from the old guys to the new. I know we’ve had a lot of tragedy and misfortune, but that’s just life.What goals do you have for the future for both yourself and Lynyrd Skynyrd?
My plans and dreams are to keep going with Skynyrd – to tour every year and do a new album every couple of years, to show people we’ve still got it.
And I don’t ever want to do a farewell tour, where we say, “This is the last time,” and then we go back out again another time like a lot of groups do. There are a lot of groups that have “final toured” 10 times.
With Lynyrd Skynyrd, I want us to just not be there one day. I would like to tour for 10 or 20 more years, writing songs and getting on like the Rolling Stones, B.B. King, or Clapton. All the blues guys just keep on going, and I think we’ll do that. – Arlene R. Weiss
Photo by Michael Wilson. Rickey Medlocke
Vintage Guitar: Many people are surprised to learn you were originally a drummer for Lynyrd Skynyrd in the early ’70s.
Rickey Medlocke: Yes, I joined the band as a drummer and played for about three years. I’ve been back now since ’96, playing guitar. I knew in my heart that I would probably never achieve greatness as a drummer and that my talents lied within guitar and singing. I left Skynyrd so that I could play guitar, and as fate would have it, it’s all kind of worked out. The vicious cycle came around and here I am, back with them again!Which players influenced you as a guitarist?
I was raised in a musical environment. My grandad, Shorty Medlocke, had his own bands and toured with musicians from Nashville and the southeast. He was even on a television show out of Jacksonville from 1953 through ’58. It was a cool schtick with a grandfather and grandson.
At the time I was playing banjo, which was my very first instrument. I had a miniature five-string and I played and sang with him until I was about eight years old. I started playing guitar when I was about five years old and guitar has always been my real love.
As a kid, I listened to records galore and radio stations back in the ’50s. I started listening to a lot of the early stuff like Elvis Presley when I was five or six years old. Of course, Carl Perkins played on some of the old Elvis Presley sessions, and I enjoyed him. He also played on a lot of sessions for Johnny Cash, Jerry Lee Lewis, and people from the Sun Records label. My grandfather listened to a lot of old Mississippi Delta blues stuff, so I ended up listening to a lot of the old black players like Sun House, Robert Johnson, Mississippi John Hurt, and Leadbelly. It was like a Mississippi Delta blues/bluegrass/country environment. The blues was really my biggest influence getting into rock and roll, and I still love the blues.
By the mid ’60s I’d started listening to the Beatles. I loved them. Then I happened to hear a Jimi Hendrix record on a local radio station and I was just in awe of what was going on with the guitar and what he was playing.
After that I followed Eric Clapton with Cream, then Jeff Beck with the Jeff Beck Group, and then Jimmy Page. In my teenage years, when I was learning how to play leads, my three favorite guitar players were definitely Hendrix, Clapton, and Beck. I still listen to those guys today. I’ve got some incredible footage of Beck playing live in Japan. His style and technique are just unbelievable. His tone is just… ahhh. You wonder what planet he came from.
I’ve always said that you bake the cake with Hendrix, Clapton, and Beck, but the icing is Billy Gibbons’ hands stuck on top. He’s always been a hero, as well as one of my dearest friends.
One of my best experiences was when we did the tour several years ago when ZZ Top and Skynyrd hooked up. My biggest thrill was getting to eat dinner at catering with Billy Gibbons and talk about cars, guitars, and music. I had the time of my life on that tour. I got to hang with Dusty, too, and he and I would take trips together. We went to the wrestling matches several times. It was just great camaraderie.
I’m also a huge Eric Johnson fanatic. He is a virtuoso. Sometimes when he’s playing guitar it’s like someone playing a violin. He’s just incredible. There are a lot of wonderful guitar players walking around – too numerous to mention. The world is full of talent, but to me those five guys are the cream of the crop.Which players motivated your choices in gear?
Without a doubt, it was Clapton, Hendrix, and Beck. The combination of Gibson and Marshall together has always been my favorite. I’m still using an old Explorer and old Les Pauls. I do use a Stratocaster once in a while for certain songs, like “Sweet Home Alabama.” I like a Strat for the cleanliness and I use it for slide a lot of times.
Rickey Medlocke with his Ibanez Destroyer. Photo by Rick Gould. Describe your live rig.
I’ve got an arsenal of guitars from the late ’50s right up through the late ’60s.
I love old guitars, and I don’t spare nothing being able to use them. I’ve taken some of my old guitars off the road, but Gibson has been wonderful enough to recreate a lot of my guitars in their Custom Shop.
I guess I’m a purist when it comes down to it, because I just love playing those old ones. I’ve still got my old Les Paul Black Beauty on the road with me and I just can’t turn it loose. I still love old Gibson PAF pickups and that’s what I love about the Seymour Duncan stuff. Seymour Duncan is the real deal. I have some ancient Seymour Duncan pickups loaded in a couple of my oldest guitars. I’ve never changed them out because they’ve never gone bad and as long as they’re still working, I’m gonna keep them there. In fact, the pickups in my black Les Paul are vintage JB models. They’re great. I basically use a lot of JBs, but I started using some other ones. I’ve got a couple of Pearly Gates in another Les Paul because for the density of the wood, they fit pretty well perfect.
For strings, I’m using a standard set of GHS .010s on most guitars. For guitars with dropped tuning, I’ll use a set of .011s. My picks are brass and they’re custom made for me by a guy named Len Milheim in Michigan. He’s got a die to cut them and he polishes and refines them like a teardrop. That’s how I get that metallic “squank” out of my strings. I’ll hold my pick with my thumb and forefinger and I’ll play with my index finger right next to it. This year I’m also using some transparent red heavy-gauge plastic picks by Dunlop that have my signature on them.
For the Vicious Cycle tour, I’ve got several old amps – hot-rodded ’70 and ’71 100-watt heads that I’ve been using for many years and an early JCM 800 head Jim Marshall gave to me when I was in Blackfoot. Skynyrd is sponsored by Peavey and I am using a Peavey straight cabinet. For effects, I use a Boss chorus and a Crybaby wah that was beefed up so it keeps the signal very steady so I don’t lose any volume.How do you set the tone controls on your Marshall amps?
Usually, I like more beefiness and bass. I like running my bass at around 6 or 7 and I like running the mids at about 3. If you’re looking at it like a clock, I like running the bass at around 2 o’clock, dropping the mids back at about 10 o’clock, the presence is straight up between 12 and 1 o’clock, and the treble is at about 11 o’clock. The volume is another story. There aren’t enough numbers up there for me! But I’ll usually run the preamp at about 2 o’clock and the master volume at about 2 o’clock.How does your live rig differ from the setup you used in the studio?
Well, actually it doesn’t differ a whole lot. I mean, 90 percent of the time what I play live is what I played in the studio. I love being able to recreate what I do live. I use Marshall amps, Gibson guitars, and once in a while a Stratocaster. I used a Stratocaster quite a bit on Vicious Cycle. But for the beefiness of the rhythm and a lot of the leads, I’m still a Gibson guy.Do you take older guitars into the studio that you wouldn’t take on the road?
Absolutely. We fight with them a lot of times for tuning, but I’m just too much of a purist.
Not too long ago, I worked with a producer who was really a stickler on the tuning thing. I am, too, but he hated us having old guitars because they just didn’t tune properly. Get over it! I’m gonna use these freakin’ old guitars because they sound like nothing else in the world!As a three-guitar band, how does Skynyrd separate things sonically and technically?
Well, each one of us has our own style, our own sound, our own tone. I have a real low-endy, beefy kind of tone, whereas Hughie has the single-coil Stratocaster sound, and Gary has a real nice smooth midrangey tone. You put it all together and it just blends great.
That’s the beauty of this band; we never fight over who’s going to play what leads in what songs because we just go with whoever’s style of lead playing fits whatever style of song it is. Actually, while we’re writing the songs, we start figuring out parts and who’s going to play where. Everything just comes together naturally.Do you all work together when writing?
Oh, yeah. Gary, Johnny, Hughie and myself, we come in with ideas and then everybody starts adding their input. That’s how we come up it, lyrics and all.How do you document the ideas?
There are usually one or two tape machines running, and we’re also jotting down notes and lyrics so we can review everything. We keep it all recorded and cataloged.Do you ever demo the songs before making the record?
We have before, and we did demo some this time around to see how the basics would work out. But on other ones, we just went in and cut the basic tracks without making demos first.Was the recording process for Vicious Cycle different in any way from previous studio experiences with Skynyrd?
Not really. It was approached the same way. Although for some of the songs, we recorded some of the tracks live and then went back and overdubbed our parts. We typically cut the basics and then go back and listen to everybody’s parts, then decide what should be replaced.
In general, we try to keep a natural feel to it. It’s really just standard procedure.
There are two tracks on the new CD now with Leon [Wilkeson] still on them. He played bass on “Lucky Man” and “The Way,” which we had started recording several years ago, before he died, and we were able to save the tracks. They made it onto the record, so we were able to put Leon on the CD one last time. It was very cool.Where do you see the most change in yourself as a player?
I’ve been playing guitar for 48 years and I’ve become more seasoned. It’s just like good whiskey – it gets better over time.
I also find that I approach things nowadays from a slightly different side. I listen to the song. When you’re young, the song plays to you and you play your part. You want it to be great and you want to shine. As time goes on, you realize that the song doesn’t make you, you make the song. It’s what you put into it. My grandaddy Shorty always used to say you have to “kiss” it, which means “keep it simple, stupid!” Simplicity is the best policy. Honestly, that’s what the average person understands. They don’t understand that in four bars you played 25 notes. They just want to hear something that moves them and gives them chills – something they can relate to.
That’s what I believe, and I’d pass that advice onto everybody. – Lisa Sharken
Hughie Thomasson with his built-to-taste Fender Stratocaster. Photo by Rick Gould. Hughie Thomasson
Vintage Guitar: Who were your main influences in style and tone? How have those influences changed from early on to now?
Hughie Thomasson: Well, they’re constantly changing…
I started playing guitar when I was eight years old and first saw the Beatles not long after that. Of course, that influenced me and I started playing in a band when I was 12. We realized early on that we could work and do a lot more shows if we learned Beatles songs. Everyone loved the Beatles and a lot of the bands in the Tampa area, where I grew up, didn’t play Beatles songs. We did, so we got a lot more gigs than they did because of that.
We also learned that we could do three cover songs then put in one of our original songs, and get away with it. However, if you tried to play all of your originals, people wouldn’t like that very much.
In my teenage years, I went through a number of different bands. Dave & The Diamonds, was the first band I was in. Then we were the Rogues, then the Four Letter Words, and then finally the Outlaws.
Then from the Outlaws, I came to Skynyrd. So I’ve had quite the long playing career, you might say, and I’ve been very blessed to be a part of all of this.
A lot of the influences I’ve picked up on along the way were from Jimi Hendrix, Duane Allman, and a lot of people of the late ’60s, like the Byrds. We loved all kinds of music, so we played all kinds of music. I guess I’m kind of a hybrid guitar player. I love everything from classical to bluegrass. I actually grew up playing bluegrass with my family. So I’ve had many influences since I started.Was guitar your first instrument?
Yes. Actually, I play steel guitar and banjo as well, but guitar is my main instrument.Which players influenced your gear preferences?
Well, that’s Hendrix. I always liked the tone of his guitar – a Fender guitar. That’s what I use and that’s what I’ve always used. It’s my main guitar. I have other guitars, but I play a Fender. I do customize them to get the sound I want – I’ll change the tone pots, or add preamps, or change pickups. I have Seymour Duncan pickups in some of my guitars, EMGs in some, and Fender Noiseless pickups in others. I also have humbucking pickups in some.
There are lots of things you can do to change the tone of a guitar right down to moving your tone knob just one number and it changes everything. The amp settings affect the sound, as well.
So it’s a combination of things, and not just the guitar. I like a clean tone with a lot of sustain, and that’s what I’ve always tried to stick with. It seems to work with my style of playing and fits well with Gary and Rickey, who play Gibson guitars. My Fender is like the meat in the sandwich.Tell us about your current live rig.
I’m using Fender guitars – mostly Stratocasters – and I have Teles, as well.
I carry a number of guitars with me, but I do have one Gibson, a Les Paul. As far as amps go, I use a Fender Super Twin and a Cyber-Twin, and a Peavey 100-watt Classic. I change the speakers in my cabinets, but I can’t tell you what those, are or I’d have to kill you!
I also have a couple of pedals by Boss – a Distortion and a tuner. I also have a wireless by Nady, and that’s about the extent of it. We keep it pretty simple when it comes to the gear. I think you get a better sound when you use less electronics. Less is more. You get a truer sound and a clearer signal. When you start putting other stuff inline, it weakens your signal from the guitar and it ends up changing before it gets to the amp.
Photo: Lisa Sharken. How do you set the tone controls on your amplifiers?
It depends on the hall we’re in. We make minor adjustments according to each venue, so it’s always different. We try to maintain the same sound, but you do have to make adjustments to get back that sound from one building to another. We go in and do soundchecks, and my guitar tech has the basic settings down that we start from every day. We adjust from there until we get the sound that I’m used to having. I like a cleaner tone, so we use the preamp a little bit lower and the master a little bit higher. But everything is pretty much adjusted from 12 o’clock. We’ll go from there until we tune it into the room.How are your guitars set up?
My guitars are set up with a .010 to .052 set and they’re set up pretty normal. I use Fender strings on some guitars and I use Dean Markley strings on other guitars. We just make sure that the guitar is in tune with itself, so that the intonation is correct on the guitar. We spend a lot of time checking that because if the guitar isn’t in tune with itself as you go up the neck, it will go out of tune on you and a lot of people don’t realize that. That’s why it sounds good when you’re playing down low on the neck, but as you travel up the neck, the guitar goes out of tune, and there’s nothing you can do about it once you’re playing.
So we’re very meticulous in making sure intonation is correct.What type of picks do you prefer?
I use a standard medium plastic pick. One thing I do is I do sharpen the edges of the picks a little bit which gives the pick a little more bite. It allows you to turn the pick sideways and to attack the string with a different edge. Some people use sandpaper to sharpen it, but I take a knife and scrape it until it becomes almost serrated. I do it on all three sides. You have to be careful because it will actually cut you. I call them “sharpened” picks. That allows me to get a lot of the “pop” overtones and the overtones that you wouldn’t normally get from a rounded smooth pick. So that’s a little secret I just gave away!Does your live rig differ from your setup on Vicious Cycle?
It doesn’t very much. However, because of all the advances in technology, in the studio we now have the option of using things like Line 6 Amp Farm for amp sounds. We did use that, but we mainly used the Cyber-Twin on a whole lot of the Vicious Cycle record. In fact, everybody in the band played through it at one time or another. We used whatever sounds best. You know, sometimes a smaller amp works better in the studio than your big rig that you use onstage. So we had a number of different rigs that we used – everything from a 15-watt Yamaha tube amp that I’ve had for about 20 years, all the way up to the Cyber-Twin, and everything in between. So it just depends on what you’re looking for that song, and the combination of the guitar and the amp to get the tone, sustain, and all the little things you’re looking for. Sometimes we would use a combination of Amp Farm and a mic’ed amp together to get the sound we were looking for. It’s tedious work sometimes. It’s really fine tuning. That’s the hard part. You get close, but you’re not there and you have to take the time to really dial it in. And you’ve got to have good ears. One thing that I found out in the studio is if you spend too much time listening to yourself or listening to the work that you’re doing too loud, you will burn your ears out and you will not hear good. So therefore, you’re never going to hear what you’re looking for – your true tone. So it’s a combination of whatever sounds best.Do you have a preference for older or newer gear?
I prefer the newer gear. I have some older guitars like my ’72 Strat that I used on the Outlaws (Arista, 1975) record. I recorded “Green Grass and High Tides” and all those songs with it. Other than that, I don’t have many vintage guitars. I kind of go through them. I play them so hard that I end up having to re-fret them a lot.
Every year or so I have to re-fret all my guitars. I’m pretty hard on them. I have a light touch, but when you play the same songs during a show like we do, and you play over and over in the same position, it has a tendency to wear those frets down in the same place. When that happens, the guitar doesn’t play well in other places down the neck. So we’re constantly working on them, keeping them fresh and ready to rock.
Nobody wants to mess with an old vintage guitar. I think if you change a saddle or pot, or anything on it, that’s going to change the sound of the guitar. And when it comes time to working on them, I don’t know. That’s why I prefer new guitars. I have guitars going back, six, eight or 10 years, but those aren’t vintage guitars in my book. I have a tendency to stay with the newer stuff and go with the modifications that I need to make them sound the way I like them to sound.
I don’t have many older guitars. I just seem to wear them out, then refurbish them and keep them. I’ve got some nice Gibson acoustics that are vintage. I couldn’t even tell you the model number on the oldest one because there’s not one on it. There’s a stamp on the inside, but I don’t recall what it is. It’s somewhere in the neighborhood of about 35 years old. I also have a rare, very old Emmons pedal steel guitar that was given to me by Toy Caldwell of the Marshall Tucker Band.
I do have quite a collection of amps. I’ve got everything from a ’65 Fender Bassman all the way up the Cyber-Twin. I have a bunch of different Fender amps including a ’65 Super Twin, two Peavey 100-watt Classics, and a 15-watt Yamaha. I did part of the Ghost Riders… (Outlaws, 1980) record with that amp. We just put a very expensive microphone on it and it sounded like a million dollars.What advice would you give to other players on developing their tone?
Just keep searching and playing and trying new things, and when you hear it, you’ll know it.But you shouldn’t be satisfied with it being just okay. It’s got to be you – you’ve got to feel it, you’ve got to know it, and it’s got to work for you. When you hit that note and it sustains just right, then you know you’re there. Sometimes guys never find that and sometimes they find it straight away. Everybody’s different and it depends on how much time you’re willing to put into it.
Like I’ve always said, you get out of it what you put into it. If you spend a lot of time working on it, then you’re going to end up getting the sound you want.
One of my favorite guitar players is Eric Johnson. He has an enormous amount of tones and sounds, and I know for a fact he spends a tremendous amount of time meticulously going through every aspect of his equipment. That’s what you have to do if you want to develop your own sound. You really have to spend the time.
What advice would you give on playing in a multi-guitar band?
It’s difficult with three guitars, like we have with Lynyrd Skynyrd and did with the Outlaws, as well.It’s extremely difficult to hear each guitar while the whole band is playing and know who is playing what. It’s something we are constantly aware of and working on, and it’s not an easy task.
If you have the right combination of people willing to work together and compromise, then you can get there. The three guitar players in this band work together very well, as does the whole band. We all have an opinion, but we don’t force it on each other. We wait and we try to help each other, and do what’s best for the band – what makes it sound like Skynyrd the most. – Lisa Sharken
This article originally appeared in VG‘s October 2003 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.
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Have Guitar Will Travel – 023 Featuring Jedd Hughes
In Episdoe 23 of “Have Guitar Will Travel,” host James Patrick Regan speaks with singer/songwriter/A-list session guitarist Jedd Hughes. A veteran of the Nashville scene, Hughes grew up in Australia before seeking musical stardom in the U.S. Here, he talks about his long, sometimes rocky, but successful road, including backing Patti Loveless, Rodney Crowell, Emmylou Harris, and Vince Gill, as well as his solo career and new album, “West.”Each episode is available on Apple Podcast, Stitcher, iheartradio, Tune In, Google Play Music, and Spotify!
Have Guitar Will Travel, hosted by James Patrick Regan, otherwise known as Jimmy from the Deadlies, is presented by Vintage Guitar magazine, the destination for guitar enthusiasts. Podcast episodes feature guitar players, builders, dealers and more – all with great experiences to share! Find all podcasts at www.vintageguitar.com/category/podcasts.
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Rod Price
Price’s highly modified Les Paul Jr. (shown here in ’77) has been his primary guitar for years. Part One
It used to be that photos didn’t lie. But nowadays (as supermodels and tabloids have proven) that’s not always true.
But it is true that when Rod Price’s slide hand is in action, it isn’t easy to capture on film – as fans of guitarist and the legendary English band, Foghat, can attest. When Price straps on his modified late-’50s Gibson Les Paul Jr., he becomes one of the best slide players in the business.
And if there’s a commonality between the man, his playing, and his music, it’s that they are all “open;” Price plays slide guitar exclusively in the key of open E, the title of his first solo album is Open (Burnside Records), and then there’s the candid manner in which he discussed his musical history and personal travails in his first real interview since the death of Foghat bandmate Lonesome Dave Peverett (VG, December ’91) in February of 1999.
Vintage Guitar: You were born in London, in 1947. Did you come from a musical family?
Rod Price: Yeah; my father was deeply into classical music, as was my older brother. The radio was also on continuously, so I got a diverse listening experience. I’d heard things on the radio like Roy Rogers’ “Four Legged Friend,” when I was a child, and I’d say to myself, “That’s not it.” It was really bizarre, because I didn’t even know what I was looking for. Then one day I heard Big Bill Broonzy, and I said, “What the heck is that? That’s what I’ve been looking for!” It was an epiphany – a spiritual experience – from hearing an E7 chord. In my world, nobody had ever added a seventh to a major chord.Was the Broonzy song on the BBC, or Radio Luxembourg?
BBC, probably around ’59. Radio Luxembourg didn’t really happen until a little later. So Big Bill Broonzy albums were the first records I got. I played those for years; he was a wonderful guitar player, and I adored his voice. His singing sounded warm, silky, and fatherly. I was sold; I knew what I wanted to do.After that, I got a country blues album that had artists like Leroy Carr, Scrapper Blackwell, and Robert Johnson on it. There was a store in London where everybody used to go to get their blues and jazz albums; a wonderful, dusty old place called Dorbel’s, which closed a few years ago, and what was great about the albums is you could get a lot of clues about the music from the liner notes.
rice caresses a Tele while gigging with Champion Jack Dupree in ’67. One of my earliest influences was Tampa Red, probably because he was one of the first guys who played single-note slide. But as far as I’m concerned, Scrapper Blackwell – the guitarist with Leroy Carr – was the man, he did some solo stuff in the ’20s, ’30s, and ’40s, and some wonderful person found him in Indiana in the ’60s and recorded him yet again. Blackwell is truly one of the most underrated players in history; his stuff sounded like Robert Johnson before Robert Johnson came on the scene. He wrote songs like “How Long” and “Blues Before Sunrise.” If you ever get to hear him, you’ll be knocked on your ass because you won’t believe what you’re hearing.
He was part Cherokee Indian, and he’s now gone – and it pisses me off that he was mugged and murdered when he was an old man. I was about 15 when I first heard him, and he blew me away more than any other guitar player I’ve ever heard.
I went through the rock and roll thing as well; the Shadows, Eddie Cochran – in fact, on my next album, I’m doing one of Eddie Cochran’s instrumentals.
It sounds like your early interest in the blues came full-circle on Open, which sounds like purist Chicago-type blues instead of earlier country blues…and it certainly doesn’t sound like blues/rock or heavy blues.
Absolutely, and I’m glad you clarified that. I could’ve done an album of all-original stuff, but I’d started with [Graham “Shakey Vick” Vickery] back in ’65, and I wanted to pay him back.Were you not as interested in rock and roll and Radio Luxembourg as others might have been, due to your dedication to purist blues?
It helped; I needed rock and roll to help become aware of players like Buddy Guy, who I didn’t even know existed; I’d grown up listening to country blues. But I didn’t have a big record collection; in my mind, the blues had already engulfed me, so pop and rock and roll were kind of meaningless.Did you take any formal guitar lessons?
I played for about a year on my own, and then told myself I’d like to know what I was doing. I left school at 15; they wouldn’t allow me in the musical appreciation society because I was one grade below. I took what were “music lessons” more than “guitar lessons,” including music theory, and I started listening to Davey Graham, a wonderful player who did an eclectic mix of blues, folk, and jazz. I played some of his songs for my music teacher, who said it was crap, so that was the day I left (laughs)!Tell me about some of your earliest instruments.
The first one was some sunburst no-name thing with f-holes. I had a couple of Höfners, and the first good electric I had was a Gibson Melody Maker, which I used with Shakey Vick’s Big City Blues Band and Dynaflow Blues. I thought I was following Eric Clapton and Keith Richards down their “guitar roads,” but I didn’t realize they had more than one guitar! I’d see Richards with something like an Epiphone, and the next time I saw him, he was playing something else. I went through a period playing a Tele, which was mainly from seeing Clapton in the Yardbirds. Then I tried Strats. When I was in those two bands, we worked a lot because we’d open our own clubs. It was a great time to experiment with guitars and get your chops together.When did you start concentrating on slide guitar and open tunings?
When I heard Robert Johnson, I told myself I’d never get that good, but I thought it might sound interesting on electric guitar, and that was before I heard Elmore James. Then there was a plethora of other influences; believe it or not, the first person I ever heard play electric slide live was (the Rolling Stones’) Brian Jones.I went home and got an old piece of brass tubing, and found I could be far more expressive in my playing. I remember thinking, “If I can get this down, I’ll be a much better player,” but I put it aside for a while. I didn’t really begin concentrating on it again until I could afford more than one guitar. When I first got with Foghat, I only had one guitar, so on the first album I played in regular tuning. I also played in regular tuning on the second album, but I’d bought a new guitar, so after that album I started concentrating on slide in open E. I don’t know why I chose it; there were very few books around. I might have gotten it from Elmore James, although I think he tuned down to D a lot. That’s the only open tuning I’ve used.
Details about your “pre-Foghat” bands?
When I was 17, a friend told me he had a band for me; they were doing Elvis Presley, rock and roll stuff. I didn’t know if I was ready, but I did it for three or four months, just for the experience. Then I went to the old, reliable Melody Maker, by that time, I was hitting the blues clubs in London, checking out Clapton and others. The magic of those times is indescribable. There were times when you could see American blues musicians like Bukka White, Little Walter, and Sonny Terry and Brownie McGee, all on the same bill! And I’m sure people like Eric Clapton and Peter Green would have been in those audiences, too. We were totally engrossed in this American music that had so much feeling and was so true and real. I wasn’t interested in something like psychedelic music at all.
Dynaflow Blues gigs at the Sunbury Blues Festival, August ’68. I was an original member of Shakey Vick’s band, but I was the last guy to come onboard. I found out by reading Melody Maker that they were looking for a guitar player, went for the audition, and got the job. Graham (Shakey Vick) really knew about all of this wonderful music, so that was when my education really began. The first rehearsal I did, [Savoy Brown singer] Chris Youlden was there. It turned out Graham and Chris co-owned a Robert Johnson album, a Blind Boy Fuller album, and one other, and each week when we had rehearsal, I’d steal one of ’em to listen to (chuckles). I’d replace it the next week, but steal another one.
Chris used to sit in with the band, and we couldn’t play very well, but we had feeling and raw emotion. Dave Peverett sat in with us, as well – he’d met Shakey and Chris years before I did. We also got to play with Champion Jack Dupree, which was a big thrill, of course.
How did the Dynaflow Blues band differ from the Shakey Vick band?
Well, Shakey Vick (laughs)…one time when at a Tuesday night gig, we asked Graham about the money from Saturday night, and he said, “Well, I spent it on the horses.” So we said, “Screw this,” but Graham and I still can have a good laugh about it, and he doesn’t mind me telling that story. We formed Dynaflow Blues with another harp player, and that lasted for about a year. The original harp player went off to college, and I was in a music store one day, and ran into Duster Bennett, who was a one-man band we had seen with Fleetwood Mac. He played kick drum, hi-hat, guitar, and harp. He did a few gigs with Dynaflow, but I’d go to his house to learn. He bought a cheap Harmony from me just so I could get a better guitar. He was a real sweetheart; he was killed in a car wreck in 1976. I thought he was the best harp player in England. My next album is dedicated to him.Black Cats Bones came after that, and definitely wasn’t a purist blues band. The Barbed Wire Sandwich album was heavy blues/rock.
It was, and that’s where Paul Kossoff and Simon Kirke were before Free. I did that for about a year also, and didn’t get much out of it.By that time, what instruments and amps were you using?
Prior to that, I was using a Vox AC-30 with Shakey Vick and Dynaflow, and a Tele, for the most part. I was playing a Strat in Black Cat Bones, through an Orange amp; they had just come out.I played with some other folks for about a year, but we never really gigged. It was, however, a year of learning for me. We had jams that went all night; a lot of them were based on the stuff Sugarcane Harris did with Frank Zappa. Although it wasn’t what I wanted to do, it was great to jam on it. That band broke up, and blues was actually waning a little bit around that time, 1970 or ’71.
One day, I looked in the Melody Maker, and an ad said, “Wanted: Blues guitarist/pianist for blues band.” I made the call – although I wasn’t a pianist and spoke with a gentleman for a long time; he was being very secretive, and eventually I said, “Dave? Is that you?”
Graham “Shakey Vick” Vickery and Price in ’67. Peverett?
Yeah, and he said, “Rod? Is that you?” (laughs). Three of the members of Savoy Brown were forming their own band, and even though we had already jammed together back in Shakey Vick, I still had to do the audition. I was kind of surprised I got the gig, because there were some great players there.Who played which guitar part on the call-and-respond intro to “I Just Want to Make Love to You,” on Foghat’s first album?
(chuckles) Dave did the first one, I did the second – where the note kind of bends down. That was a new black Strat through a Hiwatt.What do you think caused Foghat to break away from other bands back then?
(pauses) Incessant touring certainly helped. I think we had a good foundation with our dedication to the blues, and we played with every ounce of emotion and energy we had. Pure, raw excitement and energy. We wanted to play, and I think if you’ve got that attitude, you’ve got a better chance of making it. None of us ever said anything like, “Wow, wouldn’t it be great to have a gold album,” or “Wouldn’t it be great to work $20,000 gigs;” we would talk about how we could do a Willie Dixon song we liked. I think it was actually a type of innocence that gave us that edge, plus just a passion for music.A lot of players cite the band’s ’77 live album, which ends with a rave-up version of “Slow Ride.” Your slide guitar is shrieking on that track…
The album does seem a solid favorite; I think it captures the essence of what was going on. During that period, I was using a Sunn Model T 100-watt amp, an SG for slide, and a Les Paul for regular lead.
Any memorable gigs you’d want to cite?
Actually the most memorable experience wasn’t a gig; it was having dinner at Willie Dixon’s house. Around ’76 or ’77, we were in Chicago, and Shirley, his daughter, came down to the first show, and the next night, Willie came down. We were going to be based out of Chicago for a few weeks, and he invited us for dinner. It was probably the most special evening of my life. He was so humble and kind; he said, “I know what it’s like being on the road – you boys need a real good home-cooked meal.” We had a big roast, and were stuffed! That was when he’d just had his leg amputated, and his son was telling him he was needing to watch his weight. Willie looked down at his stomach and said, “I’m watchin’ it, son” (laughs). We talked about his record royalties and he pulled out all of these old 78s we were drooling over. He noted that regarding royalties, “You guys paid me,” and I think he was grateful that we hadn’t done what some others did. He really liked our version of “I Just Want to Make Love to You,” and I was really touched. Dave and I had dinner with his daughter a couple of years after he’d passed away, and she told us Willie always asked about us.In the convoluted history of Foghat’s personnel changes, you departed on more than one occasion.
I’ll be glad to tell you the whole story. Around the time we did the Stone Blue album, I was exhausted. We’d been touring constantly, and the album was a struggle to get done correctly. I remember lying on the floor in my house, asking myself, “Why am I doing this?” I had a nervous breakdown, and one thing that made it more sickening was when I walked in the Foghat office one afternoon before we had to leave for a show that evening, and I collapsed on the floor.The doctor came over and said I’d had a very severe anxiety attack; my body was telling me to stop. The doctor said, “I want Rod in the hospital right now. He’s exhausted, he’s dehydrated, he’s shot.” And I remember the manager saying, “We’ve got a gig tonight,” so he took me down to a local bar, got me a couple of shots, and put me on a plane. That was really the beginning of the end.
I made it through the recording of Boogie Motel, and I was drinking way too heavily, but I thought of it as self-medication. I went to a lot of doctors, trying to find out what was wrong with me, and this was at a time when nobody really knew much about anxiety and panic attacks. I was looking for help and I couldn’t get it. Specialists would go through me and couldn’t find anything wrong.
All I wanted to do on the road was play, then go to my room with some alcohol and leave the planet for awhile. I don’t mind talking about it, because I think it’s important for your readers to understand what happened. The point is, the rest of the band seemed to be riding the wave okay, but I was taking my soul, cutting it open, and showing it to everybody else. I did that onstage every night, and I realized later that I couldn’t do it for five months at a time.
I wasn’t that involved with Boogie Motel, and I wasn’t that happy with the direction of the music. There were problems with producers, and it seemed everyone was getting tired. What I didn’t realize, until recently, is that I wanted the band to fire me, and they did. I was gone in early 1980.
I shut down in the ’80s, and was pretty lost. I’ve found out since that I had clinical depression, which is why I was trying to self-medicate. It took a long time for the medical arts to catch up with what I had, as many people have found out.
An all-star blues jam, featuring Muddy Waters – that’s Rod on the far right; he described himself as being “in ecstasy. Part Two
In part two of his straightforward conversation, he discusses the solution to his maladies, his other affiliations with Foghat, and his new solo album, Open.
At one point, there were two versions of Foghat, one fronted by Peverett that was based in Orlando, and one featuring (drummer) Roger Earl that was handled by a PR company out of New Hampshire. You had an association with Peverett’s version in the early ’90s.
I went to England to visit my parents, and one of the people I spent time with was Colin Earl, Roger’s brother. I was feeling a little better, and told Colin I wanted to get in touch with Dave, because we’d split up, but had never really talked about what happened. Colin told me Dave was living in Orlando, so when I got back to the States, I called; I didn’t think any problem should have destroyed our friendship; we’d spent 10 years on the road together making some great music. I had no plans on getting back together with Dave. I spoke with his wife, and Dave called the next day; he was out on the road with his Foghat. We had a wonderful talk. Before you knew it, we were discussing Robert Johnson and Elmore James.
He came to Boston about a week later, and asked me to come sit in with the band. I’d started to play again, and was doing some demos. When I played with Dave, he told me I was better than I used to be, and asked me to join the band. He also had a guitar player named Brian with him, and didn’t want to let him go. I toured for a little while with them, but three guitars were too much. We did a tour in Germany with Molly Hatchet that was actually one of the most enjoyable times I ever had with Dave, but when we came back, I was still tired and still depressed, but I didn’t know it, and that’s when I left again.
I don’t know what happened with Roger going out as Foghat; I understand that at one point, Roger had wanted to use the name of one of our publishing companies, but I really wasn’t around.
When did you finally get in the clear, health-wise?
Not until three years ago, when I truly found the right doctor. I’d put on a great deal of weight and my M.D. decided, after I’d tried just about everything, that I should try Prozac. I said, “I’m not depressed” – or so I thought – but he said it would help cut my appetite. I started taking it, and for the first time in my life, I felt normal. You’ve probably heard a lot of nightmares stories about that drug, but the truth is that it was one of the first really good drugs for depression. Then I got on another prescription called Paxil, which totally saved my life, my marriage, everything. At that point, I’d started working out, and the irony was that when I really started feeling better for good, the band (Foghat) was back together.
Graham “Shakey Vick” Vickery and Rod Price, together after 30 years. And this time, it was the original foursome.
(Producer) Rick Rubin wanted to put the band back together, but he was also in the middle of recording an album with Johnny Cash. Rick got in touch with our old manager, and ultimately we didn’t end up recording with Rick; we recorded for Paul Fiskett, who had been president of Bearsville Records, and who now had Modern Records, Stevie Nicks’ label.Were you satisfied with the way Return of the Boogie Men and the live album recorded in the mid ’90s turned out?
No, and let’s take one at a time: I thought Return of the Boogie Men was a wonderful opportunity for Dave and me, because we’d gathered a great deal of material independently. So when we got together, writing the album took 10 minutes (chuckles)! Dave and I believed we should have waited on Rick, but we were coerced into this other deal, and the other producer only had a certain amount of time to work with us, because he had other projects. So to a certain extent, we were rushed; however I do believe that some of our later best work is on that album.When the Boogie Men album came out, I said I thought we should do another live album, and a video of it. At a meeting early in the tour, I said we should do it within a month, because by that time we would’ve gotten the cobwebs off and would’ve started to get hot. But as a tour goes on, you tend to get a little tired. Unfortunately, due to finances, we couldn’t do it ’til the end of the tour, so we were a little exhausted. A lot of the material we wanted on the live album didn’t end up on it. It was okay, but…
Do you still prefer the mid-’70s live album?
I never listen to them. It’s funny; whenever I do something and get it done, I go on to the next thing.Do you feel like talking about Lonesome Dave’s passing?
Another bit of irony is that when I started getting my head really clear, I told myself that I didn’t think I could record and tour like that for another five, 10 years – that’s what they were talking about doing. I had two other projects I wanted to do; one was the blues album, and the other was the next album I’ll be doing.We were taking a break, and Dave’s wife got ill, then Dave got ill. It was truly a dark time. I have a five-year-old son – my only child – and the thought of leaving him at home and not educating him in the ways of the world was too much for me. My wife is a very caring and loving woman, and she’s put up with a lot of crap over the years. It was a horrible time to leave the band, but the point is, there was never a good time to do so.
Being on the road can take a lot of the important parts of your life away from you. My son totally changed my life, and I think my music has actually improved since he was born; by giving, you get. Dave and I had talked about doing a blues album together, but it never came to pass because Dave was happy doing the Foghat thing, and he had in fact done a lot of recordings I think will eventually be released.
I spoke to Dave, basically telling him, “I don’t want to bother you with this while you’re ill, but I’ve got to take care of my family.” The good thing is there were no hard feelings; we talked a time or two afterwards.
One Sunday night, I was at (producer) Tom Dawes’ studio, putting the finishing touches on the Open album. I’d spoken to Dave about a week before, and he wanted a copy of the album. That night, my wife called and said there’d been a call from Orlando; that Dave had been told by the doctors that he only had about six weeks to live. So that night, I left New York and drove back to New Hampshire; the next morning my wife woke me to say he’d already passed away; he didn’t have six weeks after all.
What can you say? It was unexpected, because he’d been fighting it for a while.
So now, you’ve come full circle in more ways than one – back to Chicago-type blues, with Graham Vickery once again. Some will hear it and say it’s authentic, but with an English interpretation.
It’s got that type of edge, and I think it represents a part of me that was always there.I never wanted, for example, to perfectly copy an Elmore James solo. But I wanted to do everything I could with his spirit. Some people said the album has too many covers, but I don’t like that word because I was paying tribute and homage to all of these wonderful people who’ve inspired me my entire life. One of the things I hoped is that the money for the writers of those songs will get to their families. Their music has kept me alive all these years.
Any personal favorites on the album?
“Sittin’ On Top Of The World.”…which is an instrumental version of the Howlin’ Wolf song…
I’ve always wanted to do an instrumental version of it, to show people where it came from. I think it’s one of the most beautiful melodies in the world. The band was real hot, and we had no rehearsals“Sittin’ On Top Of The World” is my personal favorite, but I wanted to take all of the songs Graham knew inside out, and I wanted people to know what I used to do 35 years ago.
The slide guitar on “Sittin’ On Top Of The World” gets so high up, some might think it’s a lapsteel.
(chuckles) That’s the highest I’ve ever been on a slide. I remember after the take, Tom Dawes said, “Hey Rod, I think you were a little flat on that last note,” and I said, “Listen, there’s no room between the pick and the slide! Whaddaya want me to do?”The great thing about Tom, though – he produced (Foghat’s) Rock and Roll and Energized – is he really lets me go, but makes sure I don’t stray, y’know? He’s a gentleman and a wonderful all-around musician. I’m grateful we rekindled our friendship; he gave me a great deal of guidance.
You brought a highly-modified double-cutaway Les Paul to a Texas guitar show some years ago, and that appears to be the same one in your current publicity photo.
Greg Morgan has been my guitar tech for years, and back when I was using that SG (with Foghat), we had Grovers (tuning keys) on it, and they can tend to pull the neck down a bit due to their weight. When I’m playing slide, I don’t hold onto the neck very much, and that SG was too top-heavy. We even tried altering the strap, but it wasn’t working. He told me to try Dave’s guitar; Dave, as you know, always played Juniors. I liked the way it felt, so when we were in Nashville, Greg picked out a beat up Les Paul Jr., and basically rebuilt the entire thing. He re-routed, re-fretted it, and painted it. When I got it, I’d never played another guitar like it. It has two PAF humbuckers; I like their warmth, and I feel like the slide is my voice, so those pickups help.You see, when I used to take solos in the early days, I used to sing different lyrics to myself while I was playing the guitar, and that was how my slide playing developed.
Did you use any other guitars on the album?
That’s a ’62 reissue Strat on “Elevator Woman,” and it’s got Texas Special pickups. I also used an SRV Strat, but that Junior has been my main guitar for many years. What’s interesting is that I don’t play it whenever I’m just sitting around, but when I get onstage, I have to have that guitar. I’m not a big collector, and as the Junior pretty much defines my voice, I follow the saying about “If it ain’t broke…” The only thing I’m needing in my collection in a good dobro, and Liberty Guitars makes some magnificent ones, so I may get one of those. Otherwise, I’m happy with what I’ve got.What about current amps?
I’m using Soldano. I’ve got one made for me without reverb, it’s like one of their Atomic models, but it’s set up like a (Fender) Twin, which tells you something about wattage – it’s totally irrelevant. This thing is an absolute gem. Mike is really into his amplifiers, and they’re magnificent. He’s one of the nicest guys I’ve met.It sounds like you’ve become more of a homebody – and for good reason – but players usually do have to tour to support a new album.
I will be touring, but in a modified way. I prefer to play clubs, and I love to meet the fans. I’ll be playing on a permanent basis on the New England circuit, including New York, New Jersey, and Pennsylvania. I’ll also be going to Chicago and the West Coast, but I just won’t be doing incredibly long tours. Playing live is still the joy of my life.This is almost a philosophical finale given the type of music you love; do you think it’s possible, these days, to write new, purist blues music?
Well, the next album I’m doing is still very blues-based, but not necessarily in I/IV/V songs. I would not want to do another Open, although I’m very happy I did that album, of course. On the next one, I’ll be singing some of the songs myself, and there will be horns on some of the tracks. I’ll be doing a few covers, but I’ve already written more new songs. I think it’s the next natural step for me, and to explain that verbally would be very hard (laughs). All I want to do is be a better player.Price’s conversation about his musical and personal history didn’t pull any punches, nor does his guitar playing. The legendary guitarist now knows his priorities in all facets of life, and looks forward to making his own music on his own terms. He has certainly earned the opportunity.
This article originally appeared in VG June and July 2001 issues. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.
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Eric Clapton
Clapton in 1990 with his signature model Fender Stratocaster. Photo by Ken Settle. In many ways, 2004 marks a return to the crossroads for Eric Clapton. With his latest disc, Me And Mr. Johnson, the guitarist pays homage to one of his principal influences – the incomparable Robert Johnson. For Clapton, Johnson is the true master of blues guitar, and completing this album was a mammoth achievement. Although Clapton recorded several of Johnson’s tunes while with John Mayall’s Bluesbreakers, Cream, as well as during his solo career, this time he dedicated an entire album to the musician.
The disc began as a diversion from the recording of another album containing only original material. When needing a break from his own reserve, he turned to his roots for inspiration, enjoyment, and a separate creative outlet – bringing his band along for the ride. But soon enough, what was a side project became the stronger venture. Clapton was reluctant at first, but then took it on as a personal challenge, practically daring himself to accurately learn 14 of the original 29 songs Johnson recorded during his brief career in the 1930s. For listeners, the resulting album is a conjoining of the greats – two of the most prestigious artists meet and put forward their very best. Johnson provides the material and inspiration for Clapton to deliver some of his finest work as a player.
VG was invited to a one-on-one meeting with Mr. Clapton in New York City, where he spoke enthusiastically about his experience creating Me And Mr. Johnson, as well as the variety of events coming in the months to follow. As we learned, Clapton will kick off his next tour with a weekend extravaganza dubbed the Crossroads Guitar Festival. Scheduled for June 4-6, the festival will include a selection of workshops and manufacturers’ displays, capped by a star-studded concert at Dallas’ Cotton Bowl. Although the list of participants is still being finalized, artists such as B.B. King, Brian May, Eric Johnson, Steve Vai, Jimmie Vaughan, Joe Walsh, Sonny Landreth, and ZZ Top have already confirmed.
Following the festival will be a second charity auction of more than 50 of Clapton’s personal instruments, June 24 at Christie’s in New York City. The instruments will be displayed first during the festival in Dallas, then exhibited in Los Angeles June 8-12, and finally brought to NYC for the sale, with gallery viewings June 19-24. While the June, 1999, auction of many of Clapton’s guitars drew a great deal of attention, this one seems poised to surpass it by including some of Clapton’s most prized axes, such as his beloved ’50s parts Strat, “Blackie,” and the legendary Gibson ES-335 he has had since his days with the Yardbirds. Additionally, several other artists, including Pete Townshend and Steve Vai, have donated personal instruments, adding to the excitement. Proceeds from the auction will benefit the Crossroads Centre that Clapton founded in Antigua in 1997.
So without further ado, for the first time ever, VG proudly presents an exclusive talk with the one and only Slowhand.
Vintage Guitar: What was the inspiration for recording an entire album of Robert Johnson’s music?
Eric Clapton: It’s something I had probably been intending to do all my life, but I don’t think I ever considered that I was in a position to do it until I reached this age.I think it has something to do with maturity, self-confidence, and all kinds of things that I was fairly intimidated by – him as a performer, a writer, a player, and a singer. But I had always been influenced by him, and at the back of my list of influences, he’s kind of the core man.
When I play lead, it doesn’t really relate directly, but the essence of what I do really hinges on what I originally felt about Robert Johnson, and heard. So I kind of looked back at my career and thought, “I’ve done so many songs of his over the years, but there’s still so many left that I haven’t done. So why not take this opportunity to kind of round them all up. Round up what’s left, and even do some that have been done, like ‘Love In Vain,’ that the Stones did, and ‘Stop Breakin’ Down,’ and just dedicate an album to that.” It has always been in the back of my mind, but I never seriously considered it until now.
How did you go about selecting material?
A lot of the songs I chose came off of the first album that was released before the other stuff was discovered. So, most of my initial choices were made on the basis that they were the songs in my head from my earliest exposure to him. Things like “Kind Hearted Woman,” “Stop Breaking Down,” and “When You Got A Good Friend” were on that first album. So I went through the ones that were the obvious choices. And then when we got about five down, I started wondering if we would benefit by even thinking about trying to do something like “Hellhound On My Trail.” Because to me, some of those songs are incredibly difficult – or just appear to be undoable. And that was the chief one that I thought, well, I’ll never ever… And we actually had to work on that one. We had to listen to his version over and over again, and figure out, well… there are a couple of things here where he adds an extra bar, and we’ve got to change that. And there’s an odd note there… And we learned it as a band. We actually learned his piece as a band, and dissected it, and put it back together again. \I was really pleased in the end because when we could, we did everything live, and there are only a couple of songs where I overdubbed the vocal. I was amazed that we pulled it off.
But to begin with, the first ones we chose were “Kind Hearted Woman” and “Traveling Riverside Blues.” Then we worked our way down to the ones that I would not think about because they were too difficult. So I’d kind of put them to one side as not being possible.
So you worked your way up to those more difficult songs?
Exactly. I had to. By the time we’d done three or four, I could see it was possible. Because when we started the thing, I wasn’t sure we’d ever finish it! We did the obvious ones because they seemed to be easy and they were accessible. Now when we got to the more difficult stuff like “32-20” or “Hellhound On My Trail,” I thought that maybe it would show me that I really can’t do this, and we’ll just have to put this project on the back burner or shelve it and think about it later. But then each time we’d finish a song, I’d think, “Well, God! I didn’t think we’d be able to do this!” I got a great sense of achievement out of it.Each time. You see, the real story of the album was that I was actually in the middle of another project. I had started an album of original compositions with my partner, Simon Climie, and we’d half-written a lot of the stuff. I said to him, “Let’s try a little experiment. We’ve got the band here. When it gets difficult with our own stuff, let’s kind of have a break, and go and do a version of a Robert Johnson song – just so we could clear our heads and come back to our stuff from that perspective.”
And that’s the way it started. It was really just going to be an escape clause, and it actually became the powerful venture, and the one that had the most feeling. So that means we’ve still got an album to wrap up.
Did you record any tracks that didn’t make it onto the album?
We did two versions of “Come On In My Kitchen,” and that was it. When we stopped, we had 12, and then we had 13, but I didn’t want 13 tracks, just because I’m superstitious. So we did one more.Really, I don’t think there’s anything left that I would add. There are a couple of things that are in the same kind of mode. For instance, we did “Milkcow’s Calf Blues” and “Traveling Riverside Blues” and those represent a certain category of the things that he did. “Milkcow” is very much like “Crossroads,” and it’s also very much like “Terraplane Blues” in that it has the same motif. So I wouldn’t have considered it a good idea to do all three of those because they would probably sound just the same as one another.
So there are a lot of songs still left in his repertoire that I could do, but I chose the best representatives of each category of his, in my opinion.
And did you also choose the ones which were best suited to you as a player?
Yes.You recorded a lot of the tracks live. Was the band playing together in the same room?
Yes. The only thing was we would sometimes have the drums baffled a little bit. And if there were electrics and acoustics playing at the same time – like if Andy Fairweather-Low would be playing acoustic, or if I would be playing acoustic, then we’d be baffled, too, but we’d still be in the room. The only kind of exception to that was a harmonica, where that was going to be straight into the microphone, so we’d have him in a separate room. But it actually wasn’t overdubbed, and was performed live. We could all see each other and hear each other while we were playing. Eye contact is important.Describe the gear used for the recording of Me And Mr. Johnson. Did you incorporate a variety of setups for different sounds?
Yes. It was basically either the two Fender Twin amps that I use. One is an original ’50s blond tweed model that’s rewired and restored. That gets used a lot. Then there’s the copy that Fender made for me. They made a copy that has all the same materials, basically. It’s a lot more robust and I can use that on the road, too. And then it was really just like a variation of guitars.Most of it was done either on a Strat or vintage Gibsons, like a Byrdland and an L-5 with the Alnico pickups. Those are ’50s guitars. Then there were also a couple of Martins. There’s an OM-45 that I have – a pretty old one – and I used the Martin signature guitars a lot – the 000-42ECB and 000-28ECB. So that’s about it, really. There wasn’t a lot of equipment involved.
Were the Strats you played newer or older instruments?
They were new ones. There was the one I play pretty much all the time, which is the one that Crash painted. It’s a multicolored graffiti guitar. It’s just abstract. Crash is a graffiti artist from New York. He’s from the Bronx and he used to paint the trains. There were a few guys – Crash, Futura, Lee, Daze, and Haze. These guys used to paint subways, until it was outlawed and the city found a way to make the new trains with a chemical treatment so that the paint won’t stay on it. Crash is in his mid 40s and he was obviously a train painter when he was like 14. Now he’s legit and he paints on canvas, but still uses spray paint. I met him in the early ’90s and we became friends, and I asked him to paint a couple of Strats for me. I have a collection of new Strats and each one has been painted by one of these famous graffiti artists. But that’s the one I use most of the time.Other than the Crash guitar, have you played any of the other custom-painted guitars onstage?
No, I don’t. That’s the only one.How do you use different instruments to achieve particular tones and emotions? And how do they bring out different attributes in your playing?
It depends on what I’m trying to evoke. If I’m trying to evoke something from the ’50s, I’ll use an old Gibson. They’re quite tricky to play because I use fairly thick strings on them, so they’re louder and fatter. But it means that when I go to bend a note, I’m not going to be able to do exactly what I want. It’s pretty resistant. So I end up playing – or attempting to play – a little like T-Bone Walker would play, with that kind of sound. So it’s more of an implied bend than a full bend. I don’t really get to the note I’m trying to bend to. I kind of half get there, and then the string is too stiff. I love those Alnicos, but I have to dicker a lot with pickups so the bottom-end isn’t overwhelming, because they’re really rich bass pickups. I kind of have to let down the bottom-end, and then raise up some of the pegs in the pickup to get up to the E string and the B string.And then I play with my fingers, too, which adds a whole other dimension to the way it’s going to sound. And in fact, on most of that album, even with the Strat, I didn’t use a pick at all. When you play live, I think there’s something about using your fingers that gives it more intimacy. It’s all an intuitive thing. If I play with a pick, it’s a stage approach. I’m going for maximum attack and volume. And I don’t really follow that thinking when I’m in the studio and when we’re playing as an ensemble. I want to get inside the mix and so I’ll use my fingers. When I’m using my fingers, I’ve got much more control about how subtle it could be.
Do you fingerpick with all five fingers on your right hand?
I use the thumb and first two.On how many tracks did you use a pick?
A couple.Have you ever experimented with different picks?
No, I always use the same standard heavy pick.What are the gauges on your Strats?
They have the stage strings on them, but I’m not sure what that is. Maybe an .011 or .010…How is the action on your guitars set? Do you prefer different types of setups on particular instruments?
It’s funny, because when I start a project or if I haven’t played for a while and I go into rehearsals, I need them quite high at the bridge end. It’s almost like I need to get my finger on the side of the string to be able to push it over, because so much about what I do with an electric guitar is about bending. On an acoustic guitar, it’s the opposite thing. I want them low to begin with, so there’s not too much effort in holding them down in a chord.So it’s two different principles coming to play. But as I get more and more accomplished in my playing, like during the third week of rehearsal or even in the beginning of the tour, I’ll ask Lee (Dickson, Clapton’s guitar tech) to lower the strings on the electric and maybe even raise the acoustic. On the electrics, I probably want them to get lower as the tour goes on because the strength in my fingers has increased and I can push them easier.
Do you have a designated warm-up guitar that isn’t one you play onstage?
No. Normally, Lee will leave me an acoustic that I’m going to use, and the electric that I’m going to use. They’ll be in the dressing room in case I want to warm up. But I often don’t do any warm up at all. And I like doing it that way. There’s something innocent about that. I don’t want to dilute any of the performance before I actually play a show. I want that fresh impact to be in reserve for the stage.Is that so you can give 100 percent onstage?
Exactly.How have your choices in gear evolved over the years? What are the most essential characteristics you need to hear when you’re selecting an instrument?
Well, I think everything has got to have a very healthy midrange. I’m very suspicious of too much top or too much bottom. I mean, I respect and love all of the brands, but I always found it most difficult to, for instance, get on with Gretsch because I’m not quite sure what they sound like. I could never really get them quite right. And it’s important that any of the guitars I play have healthy attack. What I’ve gotten used to – and I suppose I’ve become spoiled by – is those Lace Sensor pickups that Fender kind of evolved. And the problem is, of course, that they’re really loud, and once you get used to that, it’s difficult to go back to the old single-coil. My old Strats are beautiful things, but when I plug them up, I think, where is it? I’m so used to the power of the Lace Sensor, especially the noiseless ones. They’re great pickups. So I’m kind of spoiled by that now. But I still like to go back to the Gibson Alnicos or the humbuckers to get that richness.Do you prefer newer guitars?
I think that Fender is doing pretty well with their contemporary stuff. They’re the ones I would turn to for a contemporary guitar. But for a vintage guitar, I think Gibsons are unmatched, especially L-5s and Byrdlands.Do you feel there may have been more consistency in the older Gibsons than in the older Fenders?
Probably, because it seemed like they were being handmade. Whether they were or not, I don’t know, but there was a certain amount of human supervision involved. But in a sense, I think the early Fenders were more like hotrods. There wasn’t a great deal of finish required. It was a different kind of animal. It was a solid guitar, and it was kind of rejecting a lot of the old guitarmaking principles.
So there were two very different choices. The vintage Gibson was more like a Stradivarius, in a sense. It had a history and there were traditions involved in its making that Fender kind of walked away from. Fender invented its own tradition.Let’s discuss the upcoming Crossroads Guitar Auction. You already sold off a large portion of your collection in the first auction at Christie’s, and this second sale is going to include more than 50 of your personal instruments. What are some of the highlight instruments being offered?
Well, the ones I didn’t want to sell the first time around! The “A” team. There’s a selection of really good Martins – 1930s Martins and a 1927 00-45, and there are a couple things like the Unplugged guitar – the 000-42. Actually, there are two 000-42s. They’re seriously good guitars. There’s Blackie, and the red ES-335 that I’ve had ever since I was in the Yardbirds. I think that’s probably the star of the show because it’s got so much provenance. It’s been around in all aspects of my career. I’ve used that on nearly every album I’ve ever made.Are there any instruments you would absolutely never consider selling?
I think the Crash guitar I’ve used over the last five years will be mine forever. It’s the multicolored Strat that’s probably the one that’s most recognized now. That was like the first of its kind. Crash has done another one especially for this guitar festival. I’m going to play it for the first part of the tour and then I’ll put that into the auction. He’s painted that guitar to be the spearhead guitar for the whole campaign. But I’d never part with the original.What about amplifiers? Are there any amps you’d never part with?
My tweed Twin. I love that thing, but every time I use it, it blows up! When it’s sounding really good, that’s the time to watch out!What will you be playing on the upcoming tour?
The new Crash guitar, and I think I’ll probably be using the Fender Twin – the copy Twin.Will you have any pedals or effects?
I’ve kind of mucked around with that AdrenaLinn – the Roger Linn piece. I think that’s a fabulous piece of equipment. It’s basically a sequencer, but it’s got some great sounds. In the end, I’ll probably fool with it in rehearsal, then just shelf it.
The only thing I still use from time to time is a wah pedal. I have the original Crybaby – an old ’60s Crybaby. Otherwise, I kind of go without. My friend Doyle Bramhall is going to be playing in the band, and he loves all of that. He’s got so much of that stuff. It’ll be interesting to see how much of that he’s going to bring along. I just get confused if there are too many options. The simpler it is, the better it is, for me.What advice would you give to musicians on developing their own style and sound?
Listen. Really learn to listen. The most important thing is to listen, and enjoy listening, too. But it’s not as easy as it sounds to listen without other stuff going on in your head. You know, just shut down the agendas and listen to what you hear. Listen to music all the time and enjoy it.What do you listen to for enjoyment?
Anything. Anything. I love to listen to the blues, but I love to listen to jazz, too. I like ’60s jazz a lot. It’s where I go to relax. We’re talking Clifford Brown and people like that, like Thelonious Monk. I listen to that a lot because it is refreshing and it feeds the other kinds of music that I play in a very indirect way.Are you more inspired by listening to musicians who aren’t guitar players?
Yes, very much. The people that I tried to emulate were actually players like King Curtis and Little Walter, who played with the same kind of attitude towards music, but their instruments were different – tenor sax and harmonica. And I was also inspired by Junior Walker. To play guitar like Junior Walker played saxophone is good fun.Many guitarists with distinct styles learned by listening to and emulating musicians who play other types of instruments.
Yes, when they take it from another area they can pick up something that’s different. It’s not as interesting and not as illuminating when they’ve only learned from listening to other guitar players.Talk about the Crossroads festival. How did you go about choosing the other performers?
The main body of the festival will be on the Sunday, June 6, when we’ll play at the Cotton Bowl. Friday will be the opening day, then Saturday will be workshops and there will be bands playing in the fairgrounds around the Cotton Bowl.
I just put together a wish list of everybody I wanted to see play, and to play with. I’ve asked them to come, and hopefully, they’ll all turn up. The only thing is that now I’ve got to figure out how I fit into it, and how to design it. We’ve got to sit down at some stage and design the program of who’s going to play where, and how long, and who goes on when. That’s a mammoth task!Booker T & The MGs is scheduled as a house band, like at the Bob Dylan tribute concert you were part of in 1992.
Yes. Well, that’s what inspired a lot of this, actually, because so many people showed up for that, and there was such good will and so much fun. I want to see people play, and I don’t necessarily want it to be where everyone comes on and does two or three songs. I mean, some people need to play an hour.Is there a theme for the musicians to follow in selecting the songs they will perform at the festival? Will the artists be playing material from your catalog, like they did at the Dylan tribute show?
No, I’ve got no guidelines on that. I want them to do what they want to do. If they want to do my songs, that’s great. But I wouldn’t take it on myself to tell anyone what to do.I’m inviting them to be there under any auspice they choose. And it’s all to promote the Crossroads treatment center. So the idea came up to do the festival, but I hadn’t even thought about how we’re going to make money to cover the expenses, because there will be a lot of overhead. Some people will be able to come, but if they bring their musicians, you’ve got to pay them, and then there’s hotel and travel expenses, and all of that.
But I think we’ll do well, financially, with the auction, which will follow on after the festival.
It’s possible that this next auction may surpass the first in both sales and excitement.
I think so, unless everyone’s got bored with that! You never know. When I was thinking about this, I was wondering if sometimes these kind of events go and kind of hit a zenith, and people say they’re tired of this memorabilia stuff. But I thought, “Well, I’m going to do it no matter what happens because it needs to be done, and it’s something I want to do. And I actually have got to get rid of these guitars!” I do! Because I feel bad just keeping them in storage. And what would happen if I lost them when I had the fire years ago? So it’s better that they go into the hands of either other collectors or players.
The Signature
FENDER’S ERIC CLAPTON STRATOCASTER
Fender’s Eric Clapton Signature Stratocaster was introduced in 1988. The current model, introduced in 2001 as part of Fender’s Artist series, is updated with Fender’s Vintage Noiseless pickups, active mid-boost, and TBX circuits, making it one of the most tonefully versatile instruments offered by Fender. Other features include a soft V-shaped neck and blocked original vintage synchronized tremolo.
Body: Alder
Neck: One-piece maple, soft V shape, satin poly finish.
Machine Heads: Fender/Gotoh Vintage-Style.
Fingerboard: Maple, 9.5″-radius.
Frets: 22 Vintage-Style.
Pickups: Three Vintage Noiseless.
ontrols: Master Volume, master TBX tone control, master active mid boost (0-25dB)
Bridge: “blocked” American Vintage synchronized tremolo
Hardware: Chrome.
Pickguard: One-ply white.
Scale Length: 25.5″
Neck Width at Nut: 1.650″
Price: $1,899
MARTIN 000-28 ERIC CLAPTON SIGNATURE MODEL
Martin’s 000-28EC Eric Clapton signature model employs the body size and 24.9″ scale length designed for fingerstyle and blues guitarists who prefer its delicate, balanced tone. Martin has also issued the 000-28ECB, which boasts Brazilian rosewood back and sides, as well as the 000-42EC and 000-42ECB, both of which sold in limited quantities in the mid 1990s.
Top: Solid spruce with herringbone rosette.
Bracing: 5/16″ scalloped
Special Features: Fine pattern herringbone trim around perimeter of top
Back: Two-piece East Indian Rosewood with HD-28-style zig-zag back strip.
Sides: East Indian Rosewood
Neck: Solid Genuine mahogany with ivoroid heel cap.
Neck Shape: Modified V-shape with adjustable Rod, old-style pointed-heel shape.
Headstock: East Indian Rosewood with old-style decal logo.
Fretboard: Ebony inlaid with Abalone diamonds and squares, with Clapton signature at last fret.
Bridge: Ebony.
Binding: Grained Ivoroid with Matching End Piece (Like Custom HD-28).
Saddle/Nut: Corian/Micarta.
Pickguard: Tortoise-color, beveled/polished.
Scale Length: 24.9″.
Tuners: Martin open-geared chrome-plated with butterbean knobs.
Price: $3,719
This article originally appeared in VG June 2004 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.
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Earl Slick
Photo by Eddie Malluk Earl Slick landed his dream gig back in 1974, when a friend referred him for a gig with David Bowie, replacing Mick Ronson. During this period, Slick recorded three monumental albums – David Live At The Tower Philadelphia (1974), Young Americans (1975), and Station To Station (1976). He went on to collaborate with other major artists including John Lennon, Yoko Ono, Ian Hunter, David Coverdale, Phantom, Rocker and Slick, and release several solo discs.
Now, nearly three decades later, Slick has reunited with Bowie, appearing on Heathen (2002) and Reality (2003). Additionally, Slick invited Bowie to accompany him on a track for Zig Zag (Sanctuary, 2003), his first solo record in 12 years. Along with Bowie, the disc features collaborations with several guest vocalists, and an assortment of instrumental tracks.
While on a short break back home in New York, VG chatted with Slick about his incredible career and the gear he has chosen along the way. Slick recalled his early days with Bowie and Lennon, and spoke about the experience of making his latest solo disc, noting the changes in his playing style and musical preferences. Furthermore, Slick offers up some valuable advice on becoming a better songwriter.
Vintage Guitar: What inspired you to play guitar, and who were your earliest influences?
Earl Slick: Everybody from my generation saw the Beatles on Ed Sullivan, and that was the beginning of it. That was the inspiration. As far as the influences go, it was very much Keith Richards and Brian Jones at the beginning because of Brian Jones’ slide stuff and Keith’s sort of twisted Chuck Berry thing, and then the Yardbirds. It would be very early on, so it would have been the Clapton and Beck period. That’s the Having a Rave Up, For Your Love period.
As a player, I developed into a hodgepodge of all those guys, with a little bit of Hendrix. But I had a hard time trying to pick out what he was doing. But what ended up happening was I took all of that in, and I never actually sounded like any one of those people.
In what ways has your approach to playing changed over the years?
The biggest change has probably been in the last six or seven years, because I started writing a lot more and I’ve been much more conscious of what’s going on sonically, as opposed to what’s going on with chops. I don’t like using my chops anymore. It bores me. I approached David Bowie’s stuff a lot differently way back than I do now. I’m playing less, but I think my playing is a lot more intense and I’m playing more to the sound of things. I’m playing simpler and a little more thematic, and a lot less jammy and bluesy than I used to. Because I write so much now, I’m approaching the songs more like a songwriter.
So, to me, onstage and even in the studio, it’s playing specific parts that have different sounds and sonics that is more interesting to me. I prefer playing rhythm more than doing all the cool-guy solo stuff. I found myself playing things and then thinking it’s boring. If it’s not doing anything for me and if I’m bored, the audience must be hating it. I think that if you just keep doing something long enough and doing it the same, you’ve got to get bored. You wouldn’t want to keep wearing the same clothes you had 10 years ago.
Which players were most influential in your gear choices?
That would have been more getting into Clapton and Beck. In the early years, my first real guitar was a Tele because I saw a picture of Beck with a Tele. I think it was on the Rave Up album.
My next real guitar was an SG because of Clapton in the Cream period – that old beat-up painted SG. From the SG I went to Les Pauls. I still used the SG, too.
The Strats probably came in around 1975, then it was Strats and Les Pauls in the studio. But live, I was pretty much using Gibsons because I hated using any kind of pedals to get the fat sound, and the Les Paul did the trick. So I tended to use the Les Paul because of the fat factor.
By the ’80s, I started going for modified Strats and Teles, and pretty much didn’t use much humbucker Gibson stuff at all. That went on for a long time. In the ’90s it was the same, and I was using beefed-up Teles.
Now I’m back on Les Pauls. I’m back to fat again. I’m using the Strat on about four songs out of a 30-song show.
Which guitars do you currently have on tour?
I’ve got a cherry sunburst Les Paul Standard with a Bigsby, and a black one with a Bigsby. Those two cover most of the show. Then I’ve got a double-cutaway goldtop Les Paul Classic. They are so cool. It’s got a thinner ’60 neck, and that’s what I have on the other ones, too. I don’t like the old ’50s neck as much. It’s an interesting guitar and it definitely sounds different from the others because it’s chambered. It’s a very warm-sounding guitar. Those guitars are all stock. It’s the first time in years that I haven’t had to modify my guitars.
I’ve also got an Epiphone Jorma Kaukonen model which has a Bigsby, too. It’s got a great neck, with a 335-style body. It sounds good acoustically, but it didn’t have the type of electric tone I wanted. So I gutted it and put in a pair of DiMarzio PAFs.
I’ve got an ESP that’s highly modified, with DiMarzio Fast Track pickups, and a modified tone control with capacitors that change how the tone control works. When I roll it off, it doesn’t get muffly. It actually sounds like a wah wah in a half-cocked position. It’s very honky and midrangy, and very sustainy. I also had a Fernandes Sustainer installed. I use that guitar on “Heroes” so I don’t have to use the E-Bow. Jerry Leonard, the other guitar player, and I are doing a very similar thing with that sustain, but he’s using the E-Bow and I’m using the Sustainer. I also use it on the second half of the solo that’s at the tail end of a song called “Sunday” from Heathen and for a song called “The Motel.”
I’ve got my Ampeg Dan Armstrong on the road with me, too. It’s a reissue. It’s actually as good, if not better, than the originals. They’re way cool. I pull that one out on the encores. I’ve also got a Tacoma dreadnaught 12-string.
Which amps and effects are you using?
I’m using Ampeg 50-watt Reverb Rocket half-stacks with Ampeg 4×12 cabinets. I love them. For effects, I’m using the Line 6 DL4 Delay Modeler, Boss DD-3 Digital Delay, and Ibanez DE7 Stereo Delay/Echo, which is a cheap-ass pedal and it’s really cool. I think it’s digital because you can get really long delaysthat you can’t get with analog pedals. Then I’ve got an Ibanez CF7 Stereo Chorus/Flanger that does some very cool stuff, and a Voodoo Labs Micro Vibe. I’ve also got a Dunlop Dual Distortion, and I’m using two Tube Screamers – one original model and one new model. I’m using the older one for the more cutting tone and I’m using the newer one for more bottom-end stuff.
The rockabilly-stylin‘ Slick, with Phantom, Rocker and Slick in 1984. Photo by Ken Settle. Do you have a collection of vintage instruments?
I’ve got a great ’69 Gibson J-45, a ’65 SG Junior, an old Strat and an old Tele. I couldn’t tell you the years, but they’re both ’60s. I bought the SG and the J-45 new, and I don’t remember when I bought any of the other ones. The J-45 gets used a lot in the studio, but I haven’t used the SG in a long time. I won’t take it on tour because I’m afraid something will happen to it.
Tell us about your experience working with David Bowie. How did you initially hook up?
I hooked up with David in 1974 through a friend, Michael Kamen, who just passed away. I’ve know Michael for 30-some years now and we had once worked together in a band. At the time, he had scored music for the Joffrey Ballet, and David was there. Mick Ronson had just left the band and David mentioned he was looking for a guitar player, so Michael threw me right into the mix.
What circumstances brought you back together after all these years?
You know what? I don’t know! I have the slickmusic.com website, where we do some CD reissues, and my webmaster got an e-mail from David’s office saying that if this is Earl Slick’s website, please have him contact us. So that’s how the whole thing started. That was the very end of ’99 or the first week of January, 2000.
What do you consider your best work with Bowie?
A lot of the reviews said David Live At The Tower. I think it’s Station To Station and Reality. On Station To Station, the title track and “Stay.” On Reality, “New Killer Star” and the title track.
Tell us about some of your studio work in the mid ’70s, after leaving David’s group.
There’s a lot of stuff, and to be honest, I don’t remember a lot of it – nor do I care to. But I can’t forget that I did two albums with John Lennon and had the time of my life.
How did you connect with John Lennon?
It was just another one of these weird things. I get a call from Jack Douglas, the producer, saying he’s putting together a band for John. He said John was in the studio and he wanted me to play on the record.
So John hand-picked you?
Yeah.
What was that like?
It was amazing. As different as they were artistically, and given the fact that John came from a band and David has been a solo artist his whole life, they operated in the same way, from an artistic point of view. When you were brought in to do something, they knew what you did and they capitalized on that.
What do you consider the highlights from the Lennon period?
The whole process! The whole damn thing – waking up every day, getting into a cab, going to the studio, and being in the studio with John. It was just like one continuous “Wow!” In a way, it was surreal. But actually, right now it’s even more surreal because it was so long ago. Sometimes I’ve got to look at the album and go, “Yeah, I’m there.” It’s funny how we’re like little kids sometimes. They put together a box set a few years ago which included outtakes from the Double Fantasy period and outtakes of some stuff that ended up on Milk and Honey. There’s one song – I think it might be “I’m Stepping Out” – and right before he gets to the solo, he yells my name. When I got it, I just kept playing it back in that one spot to hear him say my name!
As far as the standout tracks, I think “I’m Losing You” on the Double Fantasy album. I was very happy with that because I got to play a very cool solo. For some reason, playing acoustic guitar on “Beautiful Boy” was really cool, too. The material on Milk and Honey was actually recorded at the same time. The tracks we originally finished came out on Double Fantasy and then the other ones ended up on Milk and Honey. Some of it was kind of cool because it was like live. Some of the solos were live.
You also worked with Yoko Ono after John passed away.
You know, the woman has taken more beatings in the press… I found that at the time, approaching Yoko as Yoko, the person, that you know at the moment, and not the person everybody likes to slap around, that she was cool. She treated me very well. I enjoyed playing on the records. And considering that it was after John was killed, there were some emotional days, but she treated everybody just fine. I think she was viable musically, but abstract people scare the public. That’s just a fact of life.
Tell us about the formation of Phantom, Rocker & Slick. Had you known Slim Jim Phantom and Lee Rocker before then?
I’d just finished a tour with John Waite. He went in to do another record and I decided I didn’t want to do the album. So I went back to L.A. and was supposed be going to the NAMM show, but I didn’t want to go. My ex-wife said I should just go because I’d enjoy myself, and who knows, something might come out of it. So I went.
At the show, a guy comes up and says that Slim Jim and Lee from the Stray Cats want to meet me. So I go talk to them, and we hit it off. They said they had this little project going on and they wanted a guitar player for it, and they asked me if I’d like to do it. So we got together and jammed a couple of days in the studio. We had a really good time, and just went from there.
Was it difficult when some perceived you as Brian Setzer’s replacement?
Oh, I got plenty of that. We’re very different players, plus, I wasn’t the lead singer. But I really didn’t pay much attention to what people were saying. I was having a good time.
What are the best examples of your work from that period?
I thought the first album had a lot of good stuff on it. I thought “Men Without Shame” was a really good track, and it did quite well. The video did well, too. I also like “My Mistake” because Keith [Richards] plays on that with me. Then we did another record, and that was a disaster. The drugs had taken over by then and it was about a year before I got clean.
Slick in the studio with Zig Zag producer/bassist Mark Pilati. Photo by Lisa Sharken. Tell us about your experience making Zig Zag. How did the songs come together?
I started writing, and got inspired to make the record. I started recording in March, 2001, then other things came up. Then I went on the road to Japan for awhile. When I came back, I did some more writing, then I went on the road with David again. I came back and did more writing and recording.
It started as an instrumental record, then having cut the track with David, I thought it didn’t have to be an instrumental record, and I didn’t have to hire a lead singer. I thought I could just bring in some people I really like. My producer, Mark Pilati, was working on a track for The Cure. I went into the studio and did all the guitars for it, then Mark went back to London to mix it with Robert Smith. While he was there, Mark played him some of the stuff I was doing, and Robert wanted to get involved. So it all kind of happened organically.
When you’re writing, how do songs typically emerge?
It’s usually just me hitting on some kind of chord progression I like. Sometimes I’ll actually get a vision in my head where I’ll hear something, then I’ll sit down with a guitar and see if I can actually play what’s in my head.
Do you favor a particular guitar for writing?
When I get into writing mode, I have a floor full of guitars laying around, upside-down, under chairs, hanging over here and there, and there’s no particular one. It’s whatever the flavor of the day happens to be. Sometimes I’ll just put the guitar through a bunch of pedals and step on one and go, “Wow, that sounds cool.” Then I’ll start playing and all of a sudden something comes up that inspires an idea.
How do you document your ideas?
This time I was using a Tascam 4-track. I would throw down one rhythm track and one melody track, then I’d leave it alone and write another one. I also have a friend who had a rig set up at his house. I’d go over and write and record. We’d make two-minute demos with a drum machine, so they were a little more cohesive. So there was a combination of both really rough stuff and some stuff that actually sounded really good.
How did you select tracks for the guest vocalists?
The guest vocalists chose the tracks. In David’s case, I had these seven really rough pieces and we sent them, then he picked one. We did the same thing with Robert Smith, but at the time, I was recording more elaborately, meaning there was a drum machine and a bass on it, and maybe a keyboard.
That’s pretty much what we did with everyone; we let them pick one that inspired them, then we let them run. The lyrics and melodies were written by the singers.
How were their vocals recorded? Did you bring them into the studio with you, or send them the tracks?
With David, for instance, once we figured out the form he was writing in, we cut the track, then he came in and sang. With Robert, I sent him a stereo disc with the demo. He put that into Pro Tools, sang on it, and sent it back to see if I liked it, and I did. When he finished off his lyrics and melodies, we took the form that he did, and then we recut the track. We sent that back to Robert, then he sang on it and sent it back to us.
With Martha (Davis, of the Motels), we actually wrote the song together, in the same room. I had the basic guitar riff and stuff, and then she wrote the lyrics. The track was cut, then she was flown in and sang it. With Roy (Langdon, of Spacehog), we gave him the “Zig Zag” track and he gave us his lyrics. Then we put everything into Pro Tools and cut it up so it matched where he was. Plus, we did some changes to it with drum loops and other things. With Joe (Elliot, of Def Leppard), it was the same thing. It was great. The track was already cut, so all we did was get his files so we could mix it.
Was it strange, giving direction to David?
It was funny, actually, sitting there while he was doing the vocal. It was coming out great. He asked what I thought about the ending and I said, “Well, what if you tried this on the harmony…” It was ****ing weird giving him direction! I was stepping back from myself the whole time, like there was one of me at the console and one of me just watching everything in the room.
Slick’s ’69 Gibson J-45 is a longtime favorite. Other road axes include a recent-issue Gibson Firebird and a reissue Ampeg Dan Armstrong. Photos by Eddie Malluk. Which guitars and amps were used on your tracks?
The early stuff was all cut with a custom Peavey and Gibson ES-335. Then, when I came back in, I used the Peavey on some of it and put on more Les Paul. For amps, there were the Ampegs and some Line 6 Pod Pro and Amp Farm software. Mark might have used Amplitude, too.
Was the recording was done entirely in Pro Tools?
It was done in Logic (Emagic recording software). I just call everything Pro Tools. I guess it’s becoming a generic term these days like Band-Aid or Kleenex.
How many guitar parts did you record for each song?
It would depend on the song. On “Believe,” Robert Smith’s track, there are acoustic guitars on the left and right, a subtle slide guitar that goes through the track, and the ESP with the Fernandes Sustainer for texture, and for the solo. “Zig Zag” is all over the place. I just had these ideas popping out, and they all worked. So there are all kinds of guitar tracks on there.
Did you use a variety of guitars, or more variety in effects?
Different effects for different sounds. On “Pike Street,” the main thing is a Les Paul through this weird preset on the Pod XT called “Kiss The Sky.” It’s a Hendrixy sort of thing. It’s on the solo, toward the end.
Something funny about that one; I’d just gotten the new Pod XT after the basic track was cut. I told Mark I was going to mess around with it, and told him to just roll the track. So I’m playing along, and while I’m playing, I’m dialing sounds up and playing things, and dialing up more sounds and playing, all at random. That’s what became the lead track. He was rolling the tape because he knows I’m like Mr. One-Take Willie. So that’s how most of the lead track on that song came together. You’ll hear the sounds change, and that’s what happened. I had a new guitar and a new toy.
What advice would you give others on becoming better songwriters?
That’s just a matter of doing it and learning that sometimes you’re going to get these things from inspiration, and sometimes from making yourself play it until something pops out.
The trick that’s made me a better songwriter is that I don’t necessarily finish these things when I start them. I go for the inspiration. When I get the inspiration, I record it real quick, then I leave it alone and move on because while the inspiration is there, I would rather spend the time on another piece of music than pissing around trying to make the last piece perfect. I’m not one for being perfect, anyway. You can spend an awful lot of time once you come up with the main idea of putting on additional tracks here and there. By that time, you’re kind of tired and your inspiration is gone. In that few hours, I could come up with the beginnings of the songs that I’ll develop down the line. I try to catalog the ideas and then go back to them later and weed them out.
What do you listen to for enjoyment?
This week I’ve had Innervisions rolling – I’m getting back into Stevie Wonder of that period. I like a band called the Marvelous 3, and I’ve been rolling the hell out of that one. There’s a Canadian band I love called Starling, and I’ve been spinning them a lot. I’ve also been listening to the Dandy Warhols’ Thirteen Tales From Urban Bohemia. It’s a good album. I enjoy the hell out of it.
This article originally appeared in VG March 2004 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.
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Have Guitar Will Travel – 022 Featuring Adam Lester
“Have Guitar Will Travel” host James Patrick Regan speaks to Adam Lester, guitarist in the Peter Frampton Band, discussing everything from playing alongside Frampton to his friendship with fellow Aussie Keith Urban, session work, and a deep dive into his guitar collection.
Each episode is available on Apple Podcast, Stitcher, iheartradio, Tune In, Google Play Music, and Spotify!
Have Guitar Will Travel, hosted by James Patrick Regan, otherwise known as Jimmy from the Deadlies, is presented by Vintage Guitar magazine, the destination for guitar enthusiasts. Podcast episodes feature guitar players, builders, dealers and more – all with great experiences to share! Find all podcasts at www.vintageguitar.com/category/podcasts.
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Andy Summers
Summers’ with his ES-335 and his 1970s Fender Telecaster Custom. Photo by Rick Gould Best known for his innovative guitar playing in the Police, veteran English guitarist Andy Summers was into other genres of music long before he flexed his versatility in the ’80s heyday of the innovative platinum-selling band. • Summers grew up in Dorset county, on the Southern coast of England, and his interest in playing guitar was spurred by something beyond virtuoso musicianship.
“In the beginning, I was just attracted to the sound of it, the look of it,” said Summers. “My brother was into jazz, and the music I wanted to play was jazz guitar, because the coolest people were the American jazzers; the sort-of rebels were the jazz musicians. That’s where the real scene was happening, from what I could tell at that age. It wasn’t necessarily the rockers, because rock hadn’t really happened. But my ear was also attracted to the complexity of jazz guitar. It seemed more magical to me than surf melodies. I liked a lot of things, but I definitely started trying to play jazz.”
Given his affection for jazz, Summers is understandably proud of the anthology of his solo material, The X Tracks (Fuel 2000), which contains unique and listenable (primarily jazz) guitar-based music.
Like many other English guitarists, Summers started playing on a typicalHöfner model, and gradually improved not only on his playing, but his quality of instrument. One of his earliest recordings was a live album with the English soul band Zoot Money’s Big Roll Band, recorded at Klook’s Kleek in London.
Other short-lived efforts in the late ’60s included affiliations with the Soft Machine and the Animals, after which he temporarily emigrated to America and studied music, including classical guitar, at U.C.L.A. After four years, he returned to England and backed various musicians until the advent of the Police in 1977.
The worldwide success of that trio (with Stewart Copeland on drums and Sting on bass) has been well-documented, and at the time, Summers was typically seen playing a Fender Custom Telecaster with a humbucking pickup in the neck position. But he was also an early endorser of Hamer guitars. As seen in a live video by the Police, he played the opening number, “Synchronicity,” on a Hamer 12-string. Although he appreciated the original Hamer staff and the instruments they built, he said, “I was playing that weird hybrid Telecaster that I loved. No other guitar sounded as good; it provided all the magic for that band.”
The Police also made their share of music videos and got heavy airplay on MTV in the early ’80s. The post-apocalyptic setting of the video for “Synchronicity II” saw Summers atop a pile of wrecked automobiles, brandishing a Gittler guitar made by the late artist/inventor/musician Allen Gittler in New York City (VG, March ’00). Most who saw the video probably thought the skeletal instrument was a prop. “It was an interesting object,” said Summers. “I saw it in the Museum of Modern Art in New York. I met (Gittler); I went to his apartment in the East Village. I bought one, and eventually sold it. I remember being impressed that it actually did work!”
Summers’ solo career has consisted of more than one phase, including adventures into ambient/new age, as well as side projects including collaborations with guitarists Robert Fripp and John Etheridge. He has also done movie soundtrack work, including an uptempo version of “Also Sprach Zarathustra” for the 1984 film, 2010. In recent times, though, his focus has come full circle to the jazz stylings that attracted him to guitar in the first place.
Summers agrees that The X Tracks could be considered more a personal anthology than a “best of” collection. Its 12 songs were recorded between 1997 and 2002 and the package contains extensive liner notes about select tunes that include guest artists, but the guitarist was up for detailing other songs as well as those mentioned in his own writing.
“The tracks had already been recorded, so it was really a question of sequencing,” he explained. “We’d had a bit of success in England with my last release, Earth + Sky, and when we did this one, (the record company) wanted to call it The Best of…, but that’s so generic. The way I sequenced the tracks, I think it’s a nicely-rounded album; people have heard this stuff, but it’s interesting to hear the tracks in this context instead of as it was on the original albums.”
The lead-off track, “Big Thing,” starts things off in a big way. The song features powerhouse drumming from Bernie Dresel, and Summers evokes a unique guitar tone from his Gibson ES-335 through several devices. But this isn’t the original version of the song, which appeared on the 1990 album Charming Snakes. Rather, this is an updated studio version recorded in one take.
Photo by Jay Strauss Summers’ citation of the ES-335 gave us the opportunity to inquire about his 2001 limited-edition (only 50 were made) signature model Gibson, a stop-tail ES-335 in an aged cherry finish, aged nickel hardware, and ’57 Classic pickups, based on an example he has owned for a long time.
“A 335 was one of the first good guitars I got as a kid after I moved on from all the crap,” he said with a laugh. “And I was very influenced by Grant Green at the time. I had a 1960 335, which was in great shape, and I’ve played it for years; it became the guitar I used for every gig. It’s an archetypical guitar, but I think the slimline with the block under the bridge is a very brilliant model; it really covers everything and is a great workhorse.
“When designing a signature model, you shouldn’t re-invent the guitar. I wanted the same things as on my old 335, but cleaned up a bit. I took it to Gibson, and they measured everything.”
And, he added, Martin is preparing an Andy Summers signature model.
Three songs on The X Tracks were composed by Charles Mingus, and originally appeared on Summers’ 2000 Mingus tribute album, Peggy’s Blue Skylight (Fuel 2000). The most unique of the three by the jazz giant is probably “Goodbye Pork Pie Hat,” which includes a recitation of a Mingus poem, “Where Can A Man Find Peace,” by rapper Q Tip layered over the classic Mingus musical composition.
“When I was doing that album – and I’d already done an album of (Thelonius) Monk tunes – I was trying to do a broad interpretation of Mingus material, updating some of the rhythms, but keeping it as a homage to the spirit of Mingus, in the sense that Mingus was a very experimental and adventurous musician,” Summers said. “One of the thoughts I had was to get a rapper into it, to do some of the pages from Mingus’ autobiography, Beneath the Under Dog. I really liked Q-Tip. When I was in New York recording with Deborah Harry, I mentioned this to an engineer, and he said, ‘We can get him. He’s in here all the time!’ We got on his cell phone, left a message, and he called back 20 minutes later saying he’d be honored to do the track.
“The weird thing was, the moment I called him, he was standing in Tower Records, buying the video of Mingus’ life story! How weird is that? Within a half hour, he was in the studio. It just sort of fell together.”
The Mingus composition, “Boogie Stop Shuffle,” is another example of the jazz great’s inspiration on Summers. The track has a full-on jazz arrangement, but is different from Mingus’ version, as Summers incorporated a different beat, as well as a wah pedal.
“It felt very good,” he reflected. “I was interested in driving the song forward – not making it sound like Mingus’ fast boogie. I wanted to do it my own way, which was sort of reggae with a wah-wah, and we created something that worked; it really builds. But what’s interesting to me is you’re taking a chance with music like that; there are a lot of purists out there. I was very aware of that, trying to make these tracks sound good, but keeping the right spirit.”
Other guest artists on the anthology appear on songs written by Thelonius Monk, from Summers’ other tribute album to another jazz great (1999’s Green Chimneys: The Music of Thelonius Monk). The aforementioned Deborah Harry, who is a jazz chanteuse and has performed with a band called the Jazz Passengers, sings on “Weird Nightmare,” and in their first recorded collaboration since the dissolution of the Police, former bandmate Sting sings the Monk icon “Round Midnight,” where the tuning is dropped a half-step from Summers’ original arrangement.
“I’d worked out how to play it in E-minor, which sounded very nice with the open voicing of the chord,” Summers recounted. “Sting wanted to do it in the original key of E-flat minor, so all I did was set up the guitar with strings that were slightly heavier, and dropped the (tuning) a half-step.”
Andy Summers 1960 ES-335 Other songs on The X Tracks are all over the musical map. For example, “Circus” isn’t exactly mellow James Brown-type music, rather it’s a not-too-loud funk instrumental with a sharp hook. “Ruby My Dear,” one of two Wayne Shorter compositions on the album, is a reflective piece with Summers on acoustic archtop. Asked if any other acoustic archtops were to be found on the album, Summers, who owns a handcrafted Benedetto Cremona, said, “Probably not. I tend to use the 335; the only other one I’ve pulled out a couple of times in the last few years is a Gibson ES-175 Steve Howe model. It sounds fantastic.”
We also inquired about the recording setups he’s been using most recently.
“Lead guitar – the solos – are almost always recorded with a Groove Tube amp with nothing on it; just straight, through one speaker. We don’t want to add anything to it, and it’s usually done in the post section of the recording. I record solos with a different setup than what I use live, where I’ll add chorus and stereo.”
As for the future, Summers noted, “Every year seems to be different. I don’t want to go on doing gigs for the same project. I’ll never stop playing, and I’m thinking about doing something along the lines of a solo guitar concept – nylon-string – this summer. I’ve played classical guitar for years.
“I played Carnegie Hall a few months ago,” he added, “debuting a work that features variations of Balinese music – myself and Ben Verdery – who’s a great classical guitarist – and a symphony orchestra. We’ve been asked to do that again in November, and we may go to Korea at the end of the year. I’m also finishing up a guitar album with Ben and me. I may also take a one-man multimedia show on the road, utilizing photography, talking, writing, and guitar playing.”
Never content to rest on his considerable laurels, Summers continues to explore various facets of guitar music. Other players who’ve garnered critical acclaim and platinum album sales can only envision such a sojourn. After decades of impressive effort, Summers is still amazing listeners with his virtuosity, as well as his variety of musical stylings.
This article originally appeared in VG October 2005 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.