Year: 2014

Most informed guitar enthusiasts associate veteran “lounge” guitarist Mary Kaye with the unique ’50s Fender Stratocaster model (blond finish, gold hardware) that has assumed her proper name as its designation.

However, it’s ironic that she never owned a “Mary Kaye” Strat in the time that she brandished one in publicity photos of the Mary Kaye Trio. What’s more, she was an entertainer in Las Vegas in its very early days, before the Nevada locale evolved into a gigantic entertainment metropolis, and her band was at the forefront of the genesis of lounge acts

In a recent dialogue with VG, Kaye looked back on a memorable career, and offered recollections about the so-called Mary Kaye Stratocaster and her other guitars.

Vintage Guitar: I’m aware that your actual surname is Ka’aihue. Are you Hawaiian?
Mary Kaye: I am of royal heritage on my father’s side – he was a pure-blooded Hawaiian. His name was Johnny Ka’aihue, and he was the son of Prince Koheo, Queen Liliokalani’s younger brother. His stage name was Johnny Ukulele, and he was known as “the world’s greatest ukulele player.” He died in 1970.

At the age of 19, my father traveled to Michigan with the Duke Kahanamoko swim team, and met my mother, Maude VanPatten, who was a Detroit socialite; she was of Dutch and English descent. I was born on January 9, 1924. I’m originally from the “Island of Detroit!”

Considering your heritage, did you know Freddie Tavares before he went to work at Fender?
I knew Freddie Tavares as a part-time steel guitar player with my father’s group. I’m not sure if he was with Fender prior to our first meeting.

What were the earliest musical groups you played in?
I was in my first group when I was 10 years old. My brother, Norman, played the ukulele and did the lead singing. Our friend, Freddie Meyers, played steel guitar. I was playing a Martin guitar or uke… I was only singing background to my brother; I was a little too shy to sing.

The group had no name, and the only other groups I played in were my father’s groups and the [Mary Kaye] Trio.

When did you first start concentrating on guitar, and how did your style evolve?
I began playing on a Kalamazoo at the age of nine, and that lasted all of two weeks, when I switched to a Martin guitar. I never really concentrated on the instrument; my style evolved from knowing the four strings of the ukulele so well, and I wanted to use the extra strings of the guitar, as well. Between that and my ear, I developed my style. I hear it all in my head.

I played acoustic until 1949, when John D’Angelico introduced me to electric instrumentation by installing a pickup on a guitar he made for me. Later, Don Randall from Fender supplied me with a variety of Fender amps, and I continued to use them for the rest of my career. I’ve never used another brand, except at a guitar show, where I plugged into a Bad Cat amp, which was pretty nice.

How did the original Mary Kaye Trio form?
Musical differences with my father led to the beginning of the Mary Ka’aihue Trio, which later became known as the Mary Kaye Trio. All the members of the Trio had originally started with my father’s group.

The group’s main asset was vocals, and that the guitar was primarily used as a rhythm/accompaniment instrument. To what extent did the guitar figure into the mix when you performed in concert, and on recordings?
The group’s main asset was comedy. Being from a vocal era, it was a given that the vocals were an asset, but the comedy was our ace in the hole. Songs like “How Did He Look?” and “You’ve Changed” are good examples of the true comedic genius of the group.

Our personalities, audience interaction, and communication, along with the constant ad libs, were other assets that made us who we were. The late Frank Ross, the funny man of the Trio, was the greatest comedian of our time. I’m not just saying that – it’s been stated many times by a lot of the greats in the industry. He was a mentor to both Don Rickles and Shecky Green.

As for my guitar playing, it was our main accompaniment until we got to Las Vegas in 1950, where we added Frank Hudak or drums and Rudy Egan on piano.

The guitar became primarily part of the rhythm section. I led, and they followed. I played on all of the Trio’s recordings.

Details about the move to Las Vegas? You were there in the very early days of the town.
While in Chicago, we hooked up with Billy Burton, who became our manager. He brought us to the Frontier Hotel in Vegas. We stayed to reduce the financial stress that traveling caused with the I.R.S.

As for my recollection of the early days of Vegas, I’m writing a book.

Your group was part of the genesis of the lounge act concept – that such venues developed as smaller, quieter facilities separate from the main Vegas showrooms, and were more like after-hours clubs.
While playing our first gig in the main showroom of the Frontier, we were asked to stay over after our four-week engagement had ended. Without a room to go to, I suggested a stage be built in the bar area, and it could be called a “lounge.” Jack Kozloff, the owner, and Eddie Fox, the general manager, had it constructed immediately.

During its first week of operation, Frank Sinatra and friends dropped $120,000 on the tables during which became known as the “dusk ’til dawn” hours. This impressed the other hotels to the point where they began to stay open 24 hours. A little-known fact was that all of the Vegas hotels operated from 6 a.m. to 1 a.m. in the old days.

Hotels began hunting for entertainers to fill their newly constructed lounges. Not all entertainment worked, but smaller, tight-knit groups were working out better than the big bands of that time. I remember Cab Calloway and Artie Shaw didn’t do so well outside of the main showrooms.

You must have played for or in front of many celebrities…
Judy Garland, Marlene Dietrich, Vic Damone, Sammy Davis Jr., Shelly Berman, Loretta Young, Dean Martin, and many, many more sat in with us. Because we performed so late in the evening, entertainers were the bulk of our audience.

One of the more notable fans of the Trio was Elvis. He’d always ask me, “Where’d ya get those grabs?” referring to my guitar playing.

How many singles and albums did the original Trio release?
At last count, we estimated 21 singles and 11 albums, all on major labels. There are a variety of albums with singles by the Trio on them, and occasionally some oddities turn up.

Some have cited “You Can’t Be True, Dear” as an early – if not the first – rock and roll single by a band fronted by a female.
The top rock producer of that time was Don Ralke, who arranged that song for us. With his name on it, it landed in Billboard as a rock tune, and was distributed to all the school jukeboxes in the U.S., along with other rock and roll singles. There’s no other listings of another female singer in the rock genre that we could find prior to this.

You’ve owned more than one D’Angelico…
The first D’Angelico I played was owned by my ex-husband, and was built in the early ’40s. His mother bought it for him from Mel Bay, in St. Louis. It was white, and can be seen on the Trio’s Live On The Sunset Strip album cover.

I got John D’Angelico’s address from Mel Bay, and while in New York, we ordered a natural-finished D’Angelico with my name inscribed in pearl on the neckboard, for $495. Later on, I ordered an ebony Concert D’Angelico for $500. That was a lot of money in the early ’50s! John measured the necks of both guitars to fit my hands.
I fell on hard times thereafter, and needed money, so I sold them. No other guitars in the world could compare to those, except for my custom guitars.

You are most closely related to the mid-’50s blond Stratocaster with gold hardware. But it’s been reported that due to some kind of mixup, you didn’t get to keep the one you were holding in that famous Fender publicity picture.
Guitarist Steve Gibson of the Red Caps, another lounge group we rotated with, introduced me to Don Randall. Around 1954, Don brought me a Fender guitar – not the Strat – to play onstage. Though I refused to play it, Don started bringing me Fender amps to use with my D’Angelicos. In ’55, Fender delivered the blond Strat to me, prior to the Trio going onstage at the Frontier Hotel for the famous publicity shot, taken backstage. (The guitar) was returned to Fender later that evening.

Six months later, Billy, our manager, set up an arrangement with Fender to let me use the blond Stratocaster in a Columbia movie, and again it was returned to Fender.

By this time, everyone was referring to it as the “Mary Kaye Strat,” and I remember Billy was upset that the guitar was returned to Fender after Leo Fender had promised it to me. We were too busy with the Trio’s career to ever look back and correct the mistake.

I’ve since come back into contact with that same Mary Kaye Strat via the internet. Ian Ashley Hersey now owns that one, and another ’59 Mary Kaye Strat, as well.

After hearing his CD, Fallen Angel, I became an instant fan, and we’ve since become good friends. Our relationship has led to him producing my first-ever rock CD of songs written by my nephew, John Kaye.

So you did visit the original Fender factory in Fullerton?
It was a small mom-and-pop shop, like a carpenter’s factory, with the floor covered in the day’s wood debris. It was what I had expected. I was greeted by Leo Fender himself; he was very nice.

I also saw my old family friend, Freddie Tavares. I was surprised to see him there; I never knew the connection until then.

The movie that Strat appeared in was Cha-Cha-Cha BOOM!, a musical. The Trio also appeared in another film called Bop Girl Goes Calypso.
I knew very little about either film. I’d arrive, get dressed, get escorted to a Vegas-type stage with lots of extras as the audience sitting at tables, applauding our performances. I had a speaking part with an actor whose name I can’t remember. Do makeup, hair, do the shoot, and out.

Neither movie was too memorable an experience. I’ve been trying to locate a copy of Cha-Cha-Cha BOOM! ever since.

What about soundtracks for other movies, such as Boy On A Dolphin?
The owner of Fox Studios, Stanley B. Meyers, his wife Dody, and their family invited my children and me to a dinner at their home. He mentioned he had several movie projects he wanted me to sing the theme songs for; the first was Boy On A Dolphin, then there were the title tracks for Home Before Dark and Spring Reunion. I’m not sure they were all for his studio, but he was my introduction to these movies.

Wasn’t your biggest single, “Kookie, Lend Me Your Comb,” a novelty song?
“Kookie, Lend Me Your Comb” was a fluke hit; I really don’t remember much about those recordings. We did nightclub scenes for other songs for “77 Sunset Strip,” the TV series, but that (song) was the biggest hit. Eddie Burns, who played Kookie, was not a singer, but was a good-looking young actor who could rap.

Our appearances were arranged by Billy Burton. As for our biggest song, it was “My Funny Valentine,” by Rogers and Hart – that song put the Trio solidly into the recording industry.

There were times when you were nominated for the Playboy jazz poll.
We had no idea about the Playboy jazz polls until Billy brought me the certificate. We were surprised to be picked the winners; our collaborations with Robert Smale won us this award twice. Nelson Riddle, Frank Sinatra’s conductor, called Robert Smale one of the most talented arranger/conductors in the industry, and this proved it.

Of all of your albums, do you have any favorites?
A Night in Las Vegas and Jackpot! are two of my favorite albums; they have everyone’s talents showcased. Up Front! and Live on the Sunset Strip are my favorite comedy albums.

How many are available on CD?
I’ve seen several copies of all my material floating around the internet on CD. The labels never properly compensated us for [the recordings], and they’ve made ridiculous demands for us to recover the masters.

How long was the Mary Kaye Trio in existence? You were seen playing a Telecaster in that phase of your career.
All of the members of the original and the New Trio are some of the greatest musicians in the world. Ray Malus and Ronnie Douglas were with me from 1966 to ’68, after the original Trio split.

From ’69 to ’71 I worked with Dave Sullivan on guitar, Paul Delacato on guitar, and Larry Ahuna on guitar and vocals. I played with Jimmy Caravan on keyboards, and Jone Johnson – who gave me the Telecaster – on drums, from ’71 to ’73.

In ’74 and ’75, there was Jim Yates on guitar and Stephanie Haynes on vocals. I had the pleasure of working continuously with Nadine Jansen on keyboards, flugelhorn, and vocals, Jim Simmons on bass and vocals, and Dave Wilson on drums and vocals from ’74 through ’79, I had to retire at that time due to health reasons.

In 2002, Fender presented you with a new Custom Shop Stratocaster – “The White Beauty.”
I’m honored Fender presented me with such a beautiful piece of art; one of my favorite guitars ever. Not to confuse the issue, but The White Beauty was my Fender Squire Strat I played for three years, prior to receiving my new Strat.

My nephew had been soliciting Fender for quite some time, and they responded with my new addition to the family! You can see pictures of it at the Mary Kaye Trio website. It has an inscription on the neckplate which reads, “To Mary Kaye from your friends at Fender.”

It came with a certificate from the Custom Shop which reads “Model ‘Mary Kaye Stratocaster’, serial #MK001.” I believe this will be the only one made by the Fender Guitar Company because of an endorsement issue.

What keeps you busy these days?
My nephew, my daughter, grandchildren. My family keeps me on my toes at home; my granddaughters that are still at home are four and 12. That’ll keep anyone hopping!

And as of [this February], I’ve officially been playing out in public again. I’m recording the rock CD, and am also recording two contemporary CDs of the standard nostalgic songs from my era, like Diana Krall is now doing. She’s great!

I intend to find the more obscure hits that were just as famous as those Diana does, but less high-profile. These CD projects of the standards will showcase my guitar playing more than ever before.

My nephew presented me with several guitars to use on these recordings. I’ll be selling my own Mary Kaye guitars made to my own specifications, and that will have to pass my standards of quality. I plan for these to be the finest electric guitars available; the main feature will be ease of playability. I’ve never had callouses from playing guitars that are set up right.

Besides learning new songs and working on the book, I personally answer anyone who signs the guestbook on the Mary Kaye Trio website.

You still reside in Las Vegas. How do you feel about the way the city has grown and evolved from the time you moved there over 50 years ago?
From 1980 to ’86, I lived in the San Fernando Valley of California, creating porcelain dolls for the Mary Kaye Doll company. I moved to Las Vegas in ’86 to live with my daughter, Donna, and have been here ever since.

The growth of Las Vegas has been sensational! It was a little town that became a city. I’m proud to be a Las Vegan; it’s the greatest city of them all!

*For more about Mary Kayes’ Stratocaster, check out this article at www.vintageguitar.com/3255/

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This article originally appeared in VG‘s Aug. ’03 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.

Many a noteworthy rock and roll band from the Cotton Belt has been propelled by guitar-playin’ good ol’ boys with names that ring through music lore in (sometimes) poetic-sounding tandems – Allman and Betts, Collins and Rossington, Caldwell and McCorkle, Petty and Campbell, Hlubeck and Roland (or Holland!), Medlocke and Hargrett, Van Zant and Carlisi, Hood and Cooley, Richards and Baird, Haynes and Trucks…. the list, as they say, goes on.

And sometime down the road, the names Stroud and Freed might similarly roll off the tongues of those who appreciate the sound, feel, and soul-cleansing effect two fine guitarists create when their minds meld and phalanges flail!

Both natives of North Carolina, the musical paths of Peter Stroud and Audley Freed have crossed for more than two decades, but only recently have their personal and professional schedules allowed them to push forward their long-held hope to work together. The result, a six-piece band called Big Hat, just released a four-song EP that does its part to further the cause of rock the way it’s meant to be played.

Independently, Freed and Stroud have enjoyed careers with plenty of artistic high points. The former was the first to get a taste of rock stardom, when in the late ’80s he co-founded Cry of Love, a rock band whose 1992 debut album, Brother, spawned a #1 hit (“Peace Pipe”) on Billboard’s Mainstream chart and put the group square in the middle of the scene – and on some of the world’s biggest stages despite the fact it swam against a decidedly grungy tide.

Stroud’s first brush with the big-time happened in a later incarnation of the highly regarded alt-rock band Dreams So Real, which led to working with Pete Droge in the mid ’90s, and in turn to his highest-profile gig, backing Sheryl Crow starting in ’98. While Crow took time away from touring in 2000, Stroud hit the road with Don Henley, and on the 2010 Lillith Fair tour he was asked to help back singer Sarah McLachlan. After playing both sets for the first five shows, he became part of McLachlan’s touring band. Last year, he re-joined Crow as bandleader. And, he’s co-founder of 65amps, a successful – and decade-old – boutique-amp maker.

We recently spoke with both men about their musical ventures, including Big Hat, which is fronted by vocalist/guitarist Keith Gattis and includes bassist (and Freed bandmate in Cry of Love) Robert Kearns, drummer Fred Eltringham, and organist Ike Stubblefield. All of them, by the way, now serve as Crow’s backing unit, where they’re joined by Josh Grange on pedal steel and Jen Gunderman on keyboards.

We started with Stroud…

You’ve been a busy guy in the nearly 10 years since we last spoke.
Yeah! I’ve been in Sheryl’s band for 14 years now, and I’m very proud of that. A few years ago, she changed it up for a tour, which ultimately proved a good re-set for us all, and now I find I’m approaching her songs with a fresh perspective.

Touring with Sarah McLachlan was a completely different and wonderful experience – new family, new atmosphere, new set of rules. Same goes for a stint I did with Richie Sambora last fall, which was a complete blast.

It’s really great to be back with Sheryl, especially with this new band. Her new album is due out in the fall, so we’ll be busy for a while. It’s an excellent record.

How long have you known Audley?
I first heard of Audley when he had Cry Of Love. They recorded at Southern Tracks, in Atlanta – which was an incredibly cool studio that, unfortunately, no longer exists; tons of vintage mics and outboard gear, and a fabulous-sounding room – around the time I was there with Pete Droge. The engineer, Ryan Williams, was raving about them. Years later, we met when he was playing with The Black Crowes. We’d occasionally run into each other on the road, and quickly became friends. We didn’t get a chance to play together until years later, when we were both doing some recording in Nashville. There was a jam one night at Douglas Corner with Audley, Robert, and Fred, and it was soon after that I started thinking it would be great for us to put together a band. There seemed to be a connection with Audley right from the start. And once we cranked up Big Hat, it was automatic. It’s the same, playing with Sheryl.

How did Big Hat come together?
The idea was to team with various singer/songwriter friends to write and record a batch of songs, thinking the setting would be a different slant from what you’d normally hear with these artists. Keith is the real deal on the Austin and Nashville scene, and lately a successful songwriter for folks like Kenney Chesney, Willie Nelson, and Randy Travis. We’ll always consider it “a band” with Keith, ultimately. We’re wanting to hook up with Pete Droge next, and our plan is to release EPs of four to six songs with whomever we team up with. We have another five or six songs underway with Keith, as well.

Last year, you brought everyone in Big Hat aboard for the new Sheryl band…
Yeah. Things had wound down with Sheryl’s last tour and everyone in that group – which was a really cool band assembled by Doyle Bramhall, II – had moved on to different things. So, Sheryl wanted to pull together our previous guys, but I was the only one available – the rest were out with Noel Gallagher – and there was a discussion with Sheryl’s manager over how we could play a handful of shows that were already booked. I off-handedly mentioned “my band”; the next week, we rehearsed for a couple days and it felt really great. They kept booking shows, and by the end of last summer she’d made it “the band.” There was a bit of schedule juggling for a few of the guys, and Robert ultimately had to quit Lynyrd Skynyrd, which was a really tough decision, I’m sure. Fred and Josh had been touring with KD Lang – serious schedule juggling there, since KD was on tour at the time. Fortunately, it all worked out and we have a seriously killer band.

In terms of musical style, did you envision a particular direction for Big Hat?
None at all. I just wanted to see what would naturally happen with this bunch of stellar players coming from, in some ways, radically different musical places – Keith being from his country world, Ike on the other end with his deep jazz and R&B roots. The rest of us fall somewhere in the middle! Ike is one of the last real-deal Jimmy-Smith-style B-3 players out there. He’ll take your breath away. Plays the pedals, too.

Who wrote the songs on the EP? 
Audley, Keith, and I wrote the three originals. Audley and Keith primarily wrote “Feather In the Breeze” and I had brought in the general ideas for “Delilah” and “The Light.”

Talk about the vibe of “Delilah.”
That was the first thing we recorded, and I think I was probably referencing Little Feat. We had not played that song once as a band until we stepped into the studio. When Keith recorded his vocal, it was the first I had heard his fully realized melody and lyrics, and I was blown away.

“The Light” is a very vibey ballad, with the B-3 and big chords going into the chorus. 
That song fell together beautifully. It was the third one we tackled on the first day, and we were pretty high after the first two. It was late evening, so we dimmed the lights and played through it a few times. That’s Audley playing the phasered electric-guitar – one of those old Maestro units with three big switches. I played dobro and overdubbed the 12-string on the choruses. Ike’s B-3 is so beautiful on that track.

There’s a cover of Pearl Jam’s “Supersonic.” How did that come about?
I loved that song the first time I heard it, and thought it would be cool to cover. I’ve always appreciated how, in the late ’60s/early ’70s, everyone was covering each other’s songs; no sooner would someone like Dylan write a song before Hendrix would put out his own version. Or “Woodstock,” which was written and recorded by Joni Mitchell but became a hit by Crosby, Stills, Nash, & Young at the very same time… as well as Matthews’ Southern Comfort.

I want to make that sort of thing part of the Big Hat thing.

How did the recording process go down? Was everyone jamming in the room together?   
Yes, initially we were all in the same room. We had booked two days at Southern Tracks; we had never rehearsed the songs or even played together, but Southern Tracks, with Nick DiDia producing, was the perfect setting. I’ve always loved Nick’s recordings with Brendan O’Brien, so I was thrilled when he agreed to produce us. We recorded all the basic tracks together – just charted it, ran through it a few times to nail down the arrangement, then Nick would hit “Record.” By the third or fourth take, we usually had it, then we’d throw down any quick overdubs and Keith would sing whenever he felt like it. By the second song, we were all pretty excited. Keith would be laughing, saying, “I ain’t never done anything like this before!” It came together so easily. We immediately felt like we had a band.

How did you and Audley approach the guitar parts?
Well, we did our leads in an afternoon at Nick’s, after spending a little time to work out parts. We recorded the solos together. Keith finished his vocals on his own time, and we added extra percussion and backing vocals with other good friends. Nick mixed it during Southern Tracks’ last days.

What does each guy bring to the musical mix?
Well, Keith is an incredible B-bender Tele picker – he does the intro and first solo on “Supersonic.” He’s a pretty sick player, but he downplays his abilities. He’s been a solo artist for most of his career, but did a few years as lead guitarist with Dwight Yoakam. Audley and Robert go back years, having played together in North Carolina, including with Cry Of Love in the ’90s. Robert had been with Lynyrd Skynyrd up until he joined Sheryl’s band. I think his bass parts on “Feather In The Breeze” are outrageous, and he can sing like a bird.

There’s a bond between all of us, because of our musical influences and the fact we all grew up in North Carolina.

What gear are you using, for both the Sheryl gig and Big Hat? 
With Sheryl, I’ve downsized a bit. Originally, I had the Bradshaw rig and a handful of amplifiers, but now I’m a big fan of the Pedaltrain pedalboards, since I’m constantly switching out pedals.
Once 65amps cranked up, I began using the 65 London and the Monterey – London the majority of the time, Monterey for more headroom on cleaner stuff and slide.

For Big Hat, I’m not sure what I’ll use live, but probably the 65 Empire. In the studio, I used a nice old Park 75 head for “Delilah.” It’s a ’72 and has the original Genelec KT88s; it sounds ridiculous, and is probably my favorite head. I also used a blackface Deluxe Reverb; the slide on “Supersonic” was a ’59 double-cut Les Paul Junior through a late-’60s Ampeg Gemini. I played the last part through that amp before it bit the dust – power transformer blew. I had blown the output transformer a few years earlier… and the speaker. That amp’s had a tough life!

You’ve recently started working with Duesenberg on a signature guitar, right?
Yeah, I’m very proud of it. It’s essentially their Dragster set up with a Multibender bridge for slide and bender tricks. We added a neck pickup, as well, and they put a really cool short-throw Tone pot on it. It’s the first guitar to replace my original old beater G&L with the Bigsby Palm Pedal. It sounds really great and you can do some cool tricks with the two bender levers, even in standard tuning. Normally, I use it tuned to open E.

Audley Freed

Cry of Love made a pretty big splash in the early ’90s despite being rather far removed from the favored flavor of the time. What do you think struck the fancy of rock-music fans at the time?
Well, I guess they liked the songs. I’d say the gateway was the fact it sounded familiar, yet unlike anything else on the radio back then. For many years, most current stuff on rock radio– back when they played a lot of new music – had tons of reverb and the mixes were super-dense and compressed. Our music was pretty much completely dry and the arrangements had a lot of space. So, even though we played a pretty traditional style of rock-and-roll, it sounded fresh, and I think people reacted to that. Once listeners discovered the music, the fact everyone in the band was really good and what we were doing was honest… maybe it resonated.

In ’97, you hooked up with the Black Crowes. How did that come about?  
Without knowing it, I was recommended to the guys by mutual friends, which was amazing because I was a huge fan and was myself trying to figure out a way to let them know I existed (laughs)! As a result, a little while later I was asked to go to Atlanta and play an afternoon with them. We stopped one song short of the list I was given, and their drummer, Steve Gorman, said “If you get outta here now, you can beat the traffic.” I thought that was the end of it! Luckily, they offered me the gig when they started touring again the next summer. It’s a great band and I relate to their music, so I was stoked.

I sat in with them at the Ryman last month, and they were great; Jackie Greene is a great new addition on lead guitar.

As part of that gig, you got to spend a good bit of time onstage with Jimmy Page. What was that like?
That was incredible, to say the least. What can a rock-guitar player of my generation say about being given the opportunity to tour and make a live album with Jimmy Page! He was, and is, kind of the guy. I never thought would happen when I was a kid staring at the Circus magazine poster!

After that, you helped Chris Robinson…
Yeah, I co-wrote and recorded a couple of songs on his second record, then we toured behind it. It was a great musical experience, and a great guitar gig. I was really into it and understood the styles of music we were doing – lots of improv, the songs were terrific, and we played great covers in the live shows.

Another highlight was getting to play with and develop a friendship with the bass player, George Reiff. We’ve had a lot of musical adventures together.

You’ve since worked with a long list of musical heavies – Alvin Youngblood Hart, Joe Perry, Dixie Chicks, Jakob Dylan, Court Yard Hounds, Kevin Kinney, Paul Stanley, Peter Frampton, as a guest with Gov’t Mule…
It has been quite an adventure, getting to play with so many great musicians in lots of different situations and styles. Just being around that is a gift, and I learn something every time. I enjoy the fact that every situation is different on some level, and cool musical challenges are presented along the way. I’m particularly grateful that people trust me to play in very diverse musical settings and that I can make music in the mainstream, left-of-center worlds, and points in-between. I wake up every day, grateful to be able to tell young folks that dreams really can come true.

What are some of the most-recent gigs?
Sheryl’s schedule is pretty packed, but I do as much moonlighting as I can, mostly in town. A really fun gig I did not long ago at a club here in Nashville was a set of Big Star songs with Jody Stephens, Chris Stamey and Mike Mills. I’m such a fan, and playing those songs with Jody on drums was unbelievable. Some of the current or about to be released records I played on are Sheryl’s, the Court Yard Hounds, Ray Wylie Hubbard, Kid Rock, and Kenny Chesney.

How did you meet Peter? 
On a festival gig in 1999. He had just started with Sheryl and I was with the Crowes. We come from a similar background, musically, we’re close to the same age, and we’re both from North Carolina, so we had a lot in common from the get-go. We crossed paths here and there and stayed in touch, and occasionally were on recording sessions together – in fact, he recommended me for the session that indirectly led to me moving to Nashville. I have a tremendous amount of respect for him as a person and musician.

What were your thoughts when Peter pitched the concept of Big Hat?
Well, he had been kicking it around for a while, and I think his instincts were on the money. We got together at that jam here in Nashville and made a great sound right off the bat; everything was really natural – the writing, the playing, the recording process, everything.

The first time we got together was the first day in the studio, when we arranged and recorded three songs. We didn’t really know what to expect, but I think it turned out okay! The songs began with demos Peter and I had done, and I can’t overstate Keith’s contributions, lyrically, arrangement-wise, and vocally. He glued everything together. Keith is also an unbelievable guitar player. I saw him one night when he was playing with Dwight Yoakam and he blew my mind. He’s the real thing.

When Peter called to talk about the Sheryl gig, what was your reaction? 
I was really excited, having been a longtime fan of hers – she has made some of my favorite records. In fact, her gig was on the short list of answers to the question, “If you could be in any band right now…?” I’ve been so fortunate, and couldn’t believe it happened again – here I am, a big fan of an artist, but never dreamed a spot in their band would be offered to me.

Did he say what your role would be?  
We agreed that we’d just figure it out as we went along, and that’s exactly what we’ve done.

What gear are you using most lately?
With Sheryl, I’m using my trusty Matchless Lightning head and a single-12 Reeves cabinet with a Celestion G12H. I love that amp, to me it’s kind of like a low-volume Hiwatt – it has a ton of low-end and headroom. I have used in on all the tours I’ve done for the last six years and recorded a lot with it – engineers love it, too.

The guitars I play most on the Sheryl gig are a ’52 reissue Tele, a Jeff Senn Pomona with a Parsons B-bender, and a ’54 reissue Gold Top Les Paul on the Sheryl gig. A couple of pedals and I’m good to go. Simple set up and I like it that way.

On the Big Hat recordings, I used a ’52 reissue Tele and the goldtop. For amps, I used a Germino Lead 55 and a 65 London. The solo on “Feather In The Breeze” is the goldtop and the Germino with an Analogman Beano Boost. On “The Light,” I used my ’65 Gibson B-25-12 string.

Has it gone as you expected, or have there been some pleasant surprises?
I was prepared to take a pretty straightforward, note-for-note approach on all of her material, and obviously, the signature parts and hooks need to be there. But she also seems to enjoy hearing what we bring to the songs as players, in terms of feel and improvised moments, which is very rewarding.

I’m still marveling that I’m in a band full of close friends and favorite players. We’ve played all sorts of situations and combinations outside of this gig, and that familiarity helps us get beyond just giving a professional – but maybe boring – presentation of her material. Everyone is emotionally invested in the music and you can hear that. Sheryl creates an environment that encourages that approach, and we make a sound that’s special and unique. The opportunity to make that sound backing up somebody as great as Sheryl is pretty amazing.

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This article originally appeared in VG September 2013 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.

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Living testament to the versatility of the pedal-steel guitar and a rarity in pop music, Robert Randolph adroitly addresses the challenge of acting as front man of the Family Band despite mostly having to sit to play, taking command of a show by sheer force of his playing.

Whether accompanying others or going on one of his renowned flights into sounds-you-ain’t-never-heard territory, Randolph and the band create music that is compelling, soulful, and supremely energetic.

Randolph was introduced to music and the steel guitar while growing up in the Pentecostal House of God church, birthplace of a African-American gospel-music tradition known as Sacred Steel, which in the 1930s provided a platform for celebrated lap-steel players like “Little Willie” Eason and Aubrey Ghent, who used the instrument as a key feature in the worship service. The tradition holds true today, driven by current acts including The Campbell Brothers, A.J. Ghent (Aubrey’s son), and The Lee Boys.

In the ’50s, Ted Beard and Lorenzo Harrison introduced the pedal steel to their House of God congregations, paving the way for guys like Calvin Cook, Ted Beard, and others who inspired Randolph not only with their skill, but with the way they adapted the sound of their instrument.
“Lorenzo Harrison was the first to use the wah-wah with the pedal steel to create the talking, crying vocal sound we all copy to this day,” Randolph noted. “Another guy, Henry Nelson, introduced the moaning sound and played the most-precise slide parts you could ever imagine – and more soulful than anything I could play!”

Randolph, whose parents serve as a deacon and a minister in the House of God, is firmly rooted in the tradition, but has also set himself apart by taking the form secular and broadening its appeal to fans of jam-band music, rock, and blues.

“My grandmother used to watch Willie Eason,” he said. “Guys like him were our Muddy Waters and Robert Johnson. Still, to this day, I listen to a lot of old church recordings – those services were so electric. When people think ‘church,’ they think this or that, but our church is very rock-and-roll, man!”

Per the tradition in the Church, Randolph and an early iteration of his Family Band traveled extensively, performing for thousands of people from the Carolinas to Michigan and Ohio to upstate New York.

“Every time there’d be a choir program, a pastor’s anniversary, or something, we’d perform at these big events,” he said. “And we always attended their annual convention in Nashville, where we’d spend two weeks learning licks because all the original guys – the best musicians – would play there.”

This month, Randolph and the band will release Lickety Split, their first new album in three years, and first on the Blue Note label. With many of the elements from its earlier records including “cool songs with lots of guitar,” the album aims to reconnect with what brought the Family Band an ever-expanding fan base; its 12 songs include two that honor the band’s tradition of interpretating classics, this time with re-workings of The Ohio Players’ “Love Rollercoaster” and The Rascals’ “Good Lovin’.”

We recently spoke with Randolph to learn more about him, the new disc, and what is truly a family band – Robert’s sister, Lenesha on vocals, his cousin, Marcus Randolph on drums, another cousin, Danyel Morgan (bass, vocals), and Brett Haas (guitar, keys).

Was steel guitar your first instrument?
Well, I started on drums, but when I was 14 or 15, I started getting up to the steel. In the Church, steel is the main thing – you’re the big star if you’re the steel player!

Who in the Church actually taught you to play?
Well, two older guys from Detroit spent time with me – Calvin Cook and Ted Beard. They taught me basic things, but really, you had to learn on your own because it’s not like you actually have a music teacher. I’d just listen to cassette tapes of church services where they played; I’d sit for hours trying to emulate those guys, copying the sound, the feel – everything.

And while your style follows much of the Sacred Steel tradition, your playing is also obviously influenced by six-string players…
Yeah, I listened to guys like Earl Klugh to see what I could do to be a little different. One day in 1997, a cousin gave me Stevie Ray Vaughan’s Greatest Hits, and from that day until now, not more than two days go by that I don’t listen to Stevie Ray.

What about his playing grabbed your attention?
He’s just so freakin’ soulful, man! And precise. He’s got everything – fast licks, blues licks, with a rock-and-roll sound and mentality. There’s a respect in what he sings and plays, and it sounds so big. After I started listening to him, I’d get into arguments with [other players]. I’d be like, “Man, Stevie Ray’s better than Hendrix!” (laughs) They’d be like, “What’s wrong with you?” And to this day, I get into arguments about it, but I learned to understand that Hendrix is the originator of that style! But, playing in the Church, we couldn’t noodle around or experiment too much – we had to connect with a more-spiritual style of playing, and that’s where I see Stevie Ray’s thing.

Your songs convey an energy much like his did…
That’s how we were taught to play in the Church – notes and licks, be precise, and make a connection. The notes swell and sort of go into another galaxy (laughs); in church, that would be the spiritual galaxy.

Was there any particular goal or objective while making the new record?
Well, we’ve gone back to what we were originally doing – making music, coming up with ideas, and mixing influences and so forth. It’s very upbeat, energetic, positive, with great funk, great guitar licks. We have the collaboration with Carlos Santana… It’s a bit of everything.

I grew up mixing influences while keeping my own background, heritage, and tradition – positive, upbeat, and inspiring music – but also, it feels very rock-and-roll and you want to dance.

You and the band mix it up, stylistically. Do you ever find yourself staving off the perception that the pedal steel is limited?
Let me tell you something, it’s definitely not limiting. I can do whatever the hell I want to do! It surprises other people, and actually surprises me every now and then, all the things I can do with it, rhythmically! And the great part is I haven’t made the best music or the best Robert Randolph record, or played my best stuff yet. We just finished this album and already, I’m like, “I should have recorded this” or “I should have written a song with this in it.” We’ve been making so much music that I have, probably, 12 songs we could have put on this record. So it won’t be three years before we make another one. Screw that!

Your original songs cover a lot of ground.
Yeah, and that forces me to do stuff that sometimes is a little out there (laughs)! It’s funny; when I was on a different label – and there were some great people there, but we’d get into arguments over music where I was like, “If you want me to be another John Mayer, man, find someone who plays a regular guitar!”

Were they trying to get you to do something more mainstream?
Well, not so much “mainstream,” because people think that means a guy playing on pop radio or whatever. The people who work radio for the label would say, “If you just do these kinds of chords, you could get on the radio. Why don’t you do the sort of Nickelback-meets-so-and-so?” I’d be like, “What?”

Even more funny is how the label people would come to the studio and say, “Why don’t you try this, or try that?” I always think, “What the hell, man? Are you the producer? No, you’re the radio-promo guy!”

Carlos Santana reinforced my attitude about staying true to myself. He said, “Don’t let anybody say, ‘We want it to sound like this.’ You gotta sound like you and let your sound transcend one person’s perspective. If you want to be known an influential guitar player, you have to stick to your roots and keep letting your music evolve.”

On the disc, fans of the blues will dig “Blackie Joe” and “Brand New Whale.”
Yeah, I think so. It’s funny, both of them feature Carlos Santana! I also think they’ll dig “Amped Up,” which has that energy in it. But “Blackie Joe” and “Brand New Whale” have the guitar – me and Carlos smacking each other in the face. It’s got the slide licks, especially “Blackie Joe,” where you’ve got the power chords, you’ve got everything in there!

Often, you let other members of the band drive the proverbial bus. “Born Again” starts with you, but relies on Danyel’s bass line to get rolling.
Yeah, and sometimes Danyel does rhythm and bass parts at the same time. He’s from the Church, as well, and a lot of times when he played at services, there was no rhythm-guitar player, so he had to learn how to carry rhythm and bass. That’s his style. In the studio, we’ll just get into something where the rhythm guitar ends up being there just for color.

How did you decide to cover “Love Rollercoaster” and “Good Lovin’”?
I was looking at a list of songs and I came across the Red Hot Chili Peppers’ version of “Love Rollercoaster” and I said, “Let’s see if we can do a better version.” (laughs) And it came out pretty good. Danyel’s bumping away and he’s got his fills in there. “Good Lovin’” I also love, because of the major chords. To me, it’s almost like a gospel thing, something we would hear in church.

Which pedal steel do you play the most?
There’s two companies that make great-sounding pedal steels that work great, and I go back and forth because one is better for sustain, the other is better for chords and sounds better when I’m doing rhythmic stuff. One company is called Mullen [Steel Guitars], the other is Jackson [Steel Guitar Company].

On the album, I play the rhythm on a lot of stuff – I’m a Fender Tele guy, man. There’s nothin’ like a Tele! You can get a clean, rhythmic, sort of twangy thing happening. Every time I pick one up, I want to play Sly and the Family Stone rhythm guitar!

Do you play both pedal steels onstage?
At a live show, I play three – those two, and I invented a six-string stand-up pedal steel that I’ve been playing for about a year. Because you have 10 or 12 strings – I have 13 – people go, “What you do with all those strings?” With the stand-up version, you get a six-string tuning, and with the pedals you can get the major, you can get the minor, you can get your seventh. The folks at Jackson Steel Guitars are making them, and a lot of players want one – Rich Robinson from the Black Crowes, Derek Trucks.

Which amp do you use?
I actually do a combination of Fender Super Reverb and a Vibrasonic because of the dynamics of the pedal-steel – it gets so low, but you need that midrange for the slide. I’ve been working with Fender on a custom pedal-steel amp because there hasn’t been one made for the style of playing that I do. I’ve been told by everybody from Carlos Santana to Kenny Wayne Shepherd to Eric Clapton, “You’ve got to build your own rig.” They’ve seen me go through 80 different amps because I need a specific sound. It’s all in the midrange, but I have to have high-mid, low-mid, and it can’t honk too much.

Is that why you’re not playing a traditional pedal-steel amp?
That, and they have all this compression, so you can’t really dig in, you know?

Is the Fender based on one of their big, clean amps?
It’s based on the Vibraverb, the Vibrasonic, and it will have a couple of pull functions we’re borrowing from the Peavey Special 130. It’s something like the Dumble guys do; I need mids and I need that creamy stuff… but I ain’t paying no 40 grand for a Dumble, man (laughs)!

What kind of speakers will it use?
Peavey’s Black Widow. People go, “What?” But it’s funny, on the Hendrix tour there was every guitar, every amp, 50 players with custom rigs, and I went through this with the Los Lobos guys, Jonny Lang, Kenny Wayne Shepherd, Steve Vai, Joe Satriani… After I played through the Black Widow, they’d go, “Okay, I see what you’re saying…” Then I’d plug into a Celestion cab or some other speaker and they’d go, “Whoa!” With the Black Widow, I get a rounder sound that works great for my instrument. It gets the whole “thing” happening.

You’re known for using effects pedals. What’s in your signal chain?
I have this pedal called the Waterfall, which is a cool reverb/chorus. It’s made by Jam Pedals, a small company out of Canada. I’ve got 10 of their pedals and they all sound great.

How did you connect with them?
Well, we were doing the Experience Hendrix tour, and they brought all the effects for the 30 or so players to check out. They’re analog and fit the sound of my pedal steels perfectly. They make the best freakin’ phaser ever, man! I’ve spray-painted a lot of my pedalboard stuff black, so I forget the names… I don’t want people stealing my sounds – you know, the guitar people who stand in the front row and take pictures of your rig!

What kind of wah are you using?
A Crybaby 535Q. It’s the best because I can really dial in the Q and the wah effect – I can talk with that thing, man! Don Was, the legendary producer, said to me, “Man, it was mind-blowing watching you play, especially when you put the wah on. It sounds like somebody talking!”

So, if you could jam with Stevie Ray, which songs would you want to play?
Ahhhhh… (pauses)…. I would want to play “Lenny.” That song is just a soulful frickin’ thing, and me and him could go at it, slidin’ and playing around chords. And “Texas Flood.” Those two. Because Stevie kills “Texas Flood.” It’s like, “Man, I need to be in there with him!” (laughs), doing all the moaning stuff while he’s pickin’.

How would you arrange it?
Oh, he’d start the first line, “Well, it’s flooding down in Texas,” and I’d come in with somethin’ low [hums a melody, simulating the sound of the steel]… “All the telephone lines are down…” [hums another lick]…

…do a call-and-respond with his vocal?
Yeah. With his vocal and with his guitar, because he’s doing that whole mixture of the Albert King thing and his own original stuff, so I’d just be doin’ the low-midrange, moaning along with him.

Speaking of, what role does a “regular” guitar play in your band?
Well, in the Sacred Steel tradition, the rhythm guitar is played almost like reggae. Without a rhythm player doing the [makes a chop-chord sound], the music is just not complete. I’m used to that, but because of my rock-and-roll mentality and the way we stretch out, I’ve sort of learned to not really need it. But still, I sometimes like to hear a rhythm guitar so I can slide around those notes and have that space.

You’ve jammed with a lot of big names. What are some of your highlight memories?
Well, jammin’ at the Beacon Theater with the Allman Brothers, playing Madison Square Garden and Royal Albert Hall with Eric Clapton. Both of those were just great. And any time I get with Carlos Santana, it’s just magic. Things happen, especially live. And that’s one of the things people will hear more because there are a few songs Carlos and I did in the studio that are just mind-blowing – me and him just going at it. We’ll release those as B sides or album exclusives in the months to come.

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This article originally appeared in VG September 2013 issue. All copyrights are by the author and Vintage Guitar magazine. Unauthorized replication or use is strictly prohibited.

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